Leading Complexity

In this special episode of the Leading Complexity Podcast, things take an unexpected turn — The host Tomas hands over the interviewing part to Portia Tong, who interviews him instead. Together, they explore the story behind the Leading Complexity Program — how a simple idea about creating a new kind of organizational “operating system” grew into a global learning movement. Tomas shares how convers...

Listen to Linda Rising on Why Smart Groups Can Make Dumb DecisionsIn this episode, we welcome back Linda Rising, researcher and author known for her work on decision-making, groups, and organizations. We explore why bringing very smart people together doesn’t always lead to smart outcomes – and how science shows that homogeneous teams often make worse decisions, limit innovation, and fall into dan...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity Podcast, Michael Göthe sits down with James Priest, co-developer of Sociocracy 3.0 and one of the world’s leading facilitators of collaboration and decision making. We explore how leaders can act with more purpose in today’s complex organizations, and why misaligned purposes often create wasted energy and frustration. James introduces the Purposeful Action...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity Podcast, Michael Göthe sits down with Sam Isaacson — executive coach, consultant, author, and founder of AI Coach. Sam is a pioneer in applying AI to coaching and leadership. In the conversation, he shares: • How he first predicted the potential of GPT-3 for coaching back in 2020 • What’s possible (and what’s not) with AI coaches today • The difference bet...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, Tomas Björkholm sits down with Nils Janse, co-founder of Bandley AI, author of "AI Agents: Multiplying Human Potential by Adopting Generative AI"Nils has trained thousands of people and worked with over 200 companies to help them adopt generative AI. In this conversation, he shares:* Why leaders should lean in to AI instead of hesitating...

Summary In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, Michael Göthe interviews Jurgen Appelo, an influential figure in management and agile practices. They discuss Jurgen's journey from focusing on management to exploring the intersection of AI and human collaboration. Jurgen introduces the concept of 'networked agentic organizations' and emphasizes the importance of understanding the human a...

In this episode of Leading Complexity, Tomas Björkholm sits down with Dr. Jeff Sutherland – co-founder of Scrum, co-author of the Agile Manifesto, creator of Scrum@Scale, and author of Scrum: The Art of Doing Twice the Work in Half the Time. Jeff shares his thoughts on: Why much of today’s Agile is still “bad Agile” – and why it might even be getting worse. How AI is transforming the way teams wor...

In this conversation, Portia Tung and Michael Göthe explore the significance of play in leadership and organizational culture. Portia shares her journey from a technical background to becoming The Play Alchemist and an agile coach, emphasizing the importance of creating a safe and playful environment for effective leadership. They discuss the concept of 'true play,' the five attributes of playful...

How to Lead and Not Be Led by AI in Complexity — with Jonathan Reams In this episode of the Leading Complexity Podcast, we sit down with long-time Crisp collaborator Jonathan Reams — leadership researcher, teacher, and consultant. Jonathan integrates adult development, complexity science, and leadership practice to explore the frontiers of how leaders can grow in an AI-powered world. We talk about...

Join us for an inspiring conversation with Samraaj Bath , CEO of Ion Design and a two-time Y Combinator founder. In this interview, Samraaj shares: His journey from professional dancer to tech entrepreneur How Ion Design’s AI agent Ruby is changing product design inside Slack Insights on leadership, building AI companies, and staying ahead of rapid industry change Why aligning vision, incentives,...

In this episode of Leading Complexity , hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe talk with John Cutler—product thinker, UX veteran, and writer of the popular newsletter The Beautiful Mess . John shares deep insights into the everyday challenges of navigating complexity in modern organizations. Together with the hosts, he explores common pitfalls, how we accidentally create complexity, and why empat...

In this episode of Leading Complexity, Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe explore how we can turn complexity from a stress factor into a creative force. They listen to and reflect on an interview with Jennifer Garvey Berger, author of Unleash Your Complexity Genius . Jennifer shares powerful insights on how our bodies and minds are naturally wired to handle complexity — and how we can access those...

In this episode of Leading Complexity , hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe dive into self-organizing organizations with Doug Kirkpatrick , former CFO of Morningstar. Doug shares insights on how traditional bureaucratic structures, born out of the Industrial Revolution, are no longer effective in today's fast-moving world. Instead, he champions the power of simple rules to unlock intellige...

In this episode, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe sit down with Lyssa Adkins , renowned Agile coach and author of Coaching Agile Teams . Together, they explore the emerging superpowers of Agilists and the essential leadership shifts needed to navigate complexity. Lyssa shares her insights on how leaders can Upgrade, Downshift, and Expand —developing mental complexity, regulating their nervo...

In this episode of Leading Complexity , Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe listen to Marty Cagan, the renowned author of Inspired, Empowered, and Transformed . Marty dives into the challenge of complexity in modern organizations—how human nature often works against us and why over-reliance on processes can hinder innovation. Tomas and Michael break it down, highlight key takeaways, and share their...

In this episode of Leading Complexity, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe dive deeper into their interview with Linda Rising, the renowned author of Fearless Change. They reflect on Linda’s insights about patterns for leading change, psychological safety, and how to make transformations less painful. Through engaging discussions, they clarify key concepts like evangelists, small successes, an...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe listen to and reflect on their inspiring interview with Linda Rising , co-author of Fearless Change . Linda shares her experiences and favorite patterns for fostering continuous improvement and building psychological safety in organizations. Linda emphasizes the power of “baby steps” in change processes, ill...

Join hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe as they talk with Linda Rising, known as the queen of patterns and author of books like “Design Patterns in Communication Software,” “Fearless Change: Patterns for Introducing New Ideas,” and “The Patterns Handbook.” Linda explains how patterns can help us handle change and uses the story of the Swedish warship Vasa—which sank on its first trip in 1628—...

Join hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe for a thought-provoking discussion on the transformative potential of generative AI in the workplace on the "Leading Complexity Podcast." In Episode 25, they delve into Henrik Kniberg's insights from his new book "Generative AI in a Nutshell," paralleled by his widely viewed video of the same name. Together, they explore how gene...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe sit down with renowned systems thinker Peter Senge, author of The Fifth Discipline . As they delve into the complexities of leadership, Peter shares insights on system awareness, vulnerability, and the nature of complex challenges. Throughout the episode, Tomas and Michael engage in a thoughtful dialogue, un...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe dive into a thought-provoking conversation with Teresa Torres, a product discovery coach known for her Opportunity Solution Tree. Together, they explore key concepts around product discovery, including the importance of framing problems from multiple perspectives and comparing solutions to make better decisi...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe continue their conversation with Jurriaan Kamer, author of  Unblock . Jurriaan shares insights on fostering a culture of ownership within organizations, offering practical advice on how to empower teams through autonomy and emotional investment. They explore the challenges of decision-making, teamwork, and e...

In this episode of the Leading Complexity podcast, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe dive into the world of organizational unblocking with Jurriaan Kamer, co-author of Formula X and Unblock. Jurriaan shares insights on how to identify and remove the barriers that hinder organizational flow, drawing inspiration from Formula 1 to achieve speed and agility. Discover how leaders can transition f...

In this episode of Leading Complexity , Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe sit down with Bjarte Bogsnes, the pioneer behind Beyond Budgeting, to explore how organizations can move beyond traditional financial governance. Together, they unpack Bjarte’s insights on creating more human and adaptive organizations, addressing the pitfalls of conventional management models, and fostering true business ag...

In episode 19 of the Leading Complexity Podcast, hosts Tomas Björkholm and Michael Göthe engage in an insightful conversation with Mary Poppendieck, co-author of four influential books on Lean software development. Mary shares her wisdom on how leaders can navigate complexity, describing it as a “silent killer” that clogs the flow of business like cholesterol. The discussion delves into identifyin...