The Plato Paradigm

Socrates begins what should be an eristic debate. There are some attempts to make it look like an eristic debate, but the options provided allow Menexenus to avoid choosing one or other extreme, and the result of the questioning so far is no more than puzzlement over the identify of a friend in a friendship. If one loves, is the lover the friend, or the one loved, or both, or neither? Socrates als...

Lysis asked Socrates to beat Menexenus in eristic debate, but instead, Socrates declares that he is desirous of acquiring a friend or companion, far more than acquiring a quail, a rooster, a horse and dog, the wealth of Darius, or even Darius himself. He claims to have no friends, while Menexenus is the expert on friendship since he and Lysis are such good friends. Here I read through Platonic dia...

Socrates seems to be going ahead with Lysis' request to beat Menexenus in eristic debate. He is taking time to set it up, ensuring that he appears to be the underdog, pretending to complain that Menexenus is sitting with his "teacher" Ctesippus, his slightly older cousin. He also ensures that Menexenus will be the one answering questions, the best way to guarantee eristic victory. At one point in...

Lysis and Socrates continue to whisper to each other, and Lysis turns the future conversstion away from himself into an eristic match to defeat his friend Menexenus. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Hippothales, hiding close to Lysis and Socrates, becomes the focus of attention. It is unusual in a Platonic dialogue for a non-participant in a conversation to be noticed during the conversation. Socrates even states what he would have said to Hippothales had he made the mistake of speaking out loud. In orher news, Menexenus returns to the conversation. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, tra...

Socrates uses the answers of Lysis himself to prove (albeit sophistically) that Lysis shouldn't complain about his lowly status iin crafts where he is incompetent, It is not claer to me that Lysis had been complaining about this, since he had earlier explained without a hint of resentment that slaves and hired hands controlled him in varoius crafts because of his (young) age. Here I read through P...

Lysis is either a megalomaniac psychopath or possibly a young boy who is not quite grasping. the import of what he is agreeing to. He agrees with Socrtes that he should be entrusted by all and sundry around the world with any technē at which he is considered to be the best. This is a little complicated by Socrates adding himself to the mix. The whole world should entrust Lysis and Socrates togethe...

Under questioning, Lysis has been primed to think that being ruled by slaves and hired professionals in technai where he is incompetent is restrictive, while being entrusted to read and write for his parents, in the technai of reading and writing, where he is competent, is freeing and permits him to do as he desires. To say that Lysis himself actually thought like this before Socrates' questioning...

Lysis realizes that he is ruled and restricted by slaves, hired professionals, and his mother, in those arts and crafts (technai) where he does not yet understand. However, his parents allow him to read and write because he understands the technai of reading and writing. Socrates draws out the implication that Lysis will be allowed to do whatever he wants the moment he understands all technai. Und...

Even the parents of Lysis restrict his desires to technai where he is competent, but there he is allowed to do whatever he wishes, so Socrates pretends to infer. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Socrates' line of questioning establishes that Lysis is prevented by his parents, who love him very much, from doing whatever he desires. Even slaves are put in charge of him. We should remember that Hippothales is listening to this as a lesson in how to attract rather than repel his lust-obect. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resul...

Socrates begins his interrogation of Lysis. He had been considering asking Lysis and Menexenusk, before the latter left, which of them was more just and expert, but now with Lysis alone, Socrates asks him about his parents' treatment of him. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm...

Menexenus leaves the conversation, leaving Lysis at the mercy of Socrates, Ctesippus, and the many onlookers, including Hippothales who still hopes to learn how to speak to his lust object without repelling him. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Stage directions about who sits or stands where for the conversation between Socrates, Menexenus, and Lysis Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Socrates innocently describes the scene as he and Ctesippus, followed by the others, enter the palaestra. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Socrates promises.to demonstrate to Hippothales how to speak to one's lust object in a way which will attract rather than repel. Hippithales is. deviously inventive when it comes to helping Socrates talk to Lysis, enlisting the aid of Ctesippus and Ctesippus' cousin Menexenus in order to facilitate the meeting. Hippothales appears not to have noticed that Socrates has successfully engineered a con...

Socrates criticizes Hippothales for his speeches and songs, but not for the right reason. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Ctesippus describes to Socrates the sort of ridiculous praise his friend Hippothales has been directing at Lysis. It turns out that Hippothales is not in fact praising Lysis. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

We learn some more about Lysis, the formal subject of this part of the conversation. Lysis is the son of Democrates of the deme Aixone, so he is of an aristocratic family. He seems to have it all - looks, wealth, status, reputation, and a course in wrestling. We should not forget, however, the the most important things we learn are from characters themselves, about themselves, and here we learn qu...

Ctesippus enters the chat. He informs Socrates that Hippothales is so obsessed with Lysis that he is an annoyance to Ctesippus and the others of their age group. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Socrates, using his god-given gift to recognize lusters and lusted, quickly ascertains that Hippothales is lusting after a younger boy in the wrestling school. Socrates' profession of ignorance with regard to all other things should be taken with a grain of salt, as should be the notion that a god was required to give Socrates the ability to deduce Hippothales' infatuation with someone. Here I rea...

The youths, including Hippothales and Ctesippus, are assmbled outside of a palaestra, where they spend time in words. During this introductory chat we come to appreciate one feature of Socratic dialectic, namely how Plato's Socrates sets up conversations in advance. We should not apply this feature to Socrates in every dialogue, but it is certainly a feature in the later early dialogues, and some...

Socrates says he was walking from Academy straight to Lyceum, but on the way encountered a crowd of youths. Is he about to be mugged under the city wall of Athens? Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com

Socrates conceals his dialectic exercise with rhetoric and even eristics in an attempt to make Io, who enjoys listening to sophists (he says "you sophoi"), and consequently nice rhetorical stories such as the magnet analogy, actually consider what his rhapsodic techne is. It does include thousands of Homeric lines as subject matter, but this does not mean he is an expert (has the techne) regarding...

What the dialogue is not about. Here I read through Platonic dialogues, translating and commenting on the Greek text as I go. The resulting analyses may be found at: https://theplatoparadigm.com