The ThoughtStretchers Podcast

Drew Perkins talks with Sean Morrisey to discuss the pedagogical philosophy and curriculum design behind the Word Mapping Project. Discover how this innovative approach interweaves spelling, vocabulary, morphology, and fluency into a single manageable daily lesson for upper elementary and middle school students. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some feedback you'd like to share? Yo...

Drew Perkins sits down with Heather Peske, President of the National Council on Teacher Quality (NCTQ) to examine critical strategies for teacher compensation, fiscal constraints, and strategic school funding. As school districts nationwide confront a looming fiscal crisis driven by declining student enrollment, rising operational costs, and the September 2025 expiration of federal ESSER funds, ba...

Drew Perkins is joined by Neal McCluskey to discuss his new book, Fighting for the Freedom to Learn. We move beyond the common narrative that school choice is a modern, free-market invention of the 1950s, instead tracing the historical roots of educational pluralism back to the colonial era. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some feedback you'd like to share? You can email me at  dr...

In this episode, Drew Perkins  is joined by Dr. Nathan Dolenc to unpack his recent critique of the Next Generation Science Standards (NGSS), detailed in his report,  Good Intentions, Bad Implementation . While acknowledging the positive intentions behind the standards, Dolenc argues that the current implementation inadvertently prioritizes methods and inquiry over fundamental scientific principles...

In this episode, Drew Perkins talks with veteran high school math teacher and author Kristen Smith to discuss her evolution from a more traditional approach to math teaching, in the style of Teach Like a Champion, to one that might best be described as "teacher-led inquiry". We explore her "Inquiry Sandwich" methodology—a balanced pedagogical framework that leverages explicit routines to build flu...

Drew Perkins talks with Ron Noble, Chief of Teacher Prep at the National Council on Teacher Quality (NCTQ) to discuss the "Transforming Teacher Prep" initiative. We explore why pre-service training often misses the mark and how prioritizing clinical practice, curriculum literacy, and the science of learning can fix it. Plus, Ron shares how NCTQ's new District Policy Pathfinder is bringing much-nee...

Drew Perkins welcomes math teacher and author Michael Pershan to explore the history of CLT and how he thinks about applying Cognitive Load Theory in his math teaching. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some feedback you'd like to share? You can email me at  drew@thoughtstretchers.org . If you enjoyed this episode, please share it and please leave a review on Apple Podcasts or where...

In this episode Drew Perkins talks with Haili Hughes, Associate Professor at La Trobe University in Melbourne, Australia about her work and thinking on education and teaching. More specifically, this conversation touched on matters of education tribalism, research, it's lethal mutations, and how to put those findings into practice as part of ongoing teacher development and empowerment. Links & Res...

Drew Perkins talks with Mark Enser about his Substack piece titled, A Pedagogy for Powerful Knowledge | Why dialogue, enquiry and cognitive science aren't competing answers.  This episode addresses questions like: "How to combine cognitive science with inquiry-based learning", "Differences between classroom discussion and dialogic teaching", "Why inquiry requires high-level scaffolding", and "How...

Drew Perkins talks with with author and educator Christian Moore to critically examine the "just tell them" model of instruction often championed by popular "science of learning" advocates. Drawing from his book, Teaching Meaning: What Works When Telling Isn't Enough , Moore introduces the framework of "enactivism"—the cognitive science-based perspective that meaning cannot be simply transmitted f...

In this episode of the ThoughtStretchers Education Podcast, Drew Perkins talks with leading education thinkers Dylan Wiliam, Jo Boaler, and Chris Harrison to explore the work and life of Paul Black and his profound impact on teaching and learning, especially the concept of assessment for learning. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some feedback you'd like to share? You can email me...

Drew Perkins talks with James Moore, author of Explain Yourself: Master the Art of Explanation in the Age of AI , about how educators and communicators can effectively teach complex concepts. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some feedback you'd like to share? You can email me at drew@thoughtstretchers.org . If you enjoyed this episode, please share it and please leave a review on A...

Drew Perkins talks with education journalist and author Holly Korbey to explore the complex intersection of cognitive science and progressive pedagogy. While the "Reading Wars" often dominate headlines, Drew and Holly dig deeper into the underlying tensions between explicit, knowledge-rich instruction and the desire for student-led inquiry. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some fee...

Drew Perkins welcomes back Ted Dintersmith to discuss the urgent need to move away from an education system obsessed with standardized testing and toward one that empowers students to do real, meaningful work. In his new book, Aftermath , and documentary, Multiple Choice, Dintersmith argues that our current system is "perfectly designed" to produce results that are increasingly irrelevant in an ag...

Drew Perkins talks with David Geary, a cognitive developmental and evolutionary psychologist and Curator's Professor in the Department of Psychological Sciences at the University of Missouri. They dive into the foundations of evolutionary educational psychology, exploring how our evolutionary history shapes the way we learn today and why certain types of knowledge are fundamentally more difficult...

Drew Perkins welcomes Patrick Graff, Senior Fellow at the American Federation for Children, to discuss his recent research analyzing 15 years of Florida's tax-credit scholarship program. Graff presents a compelling case for why "competition effects" may be significantly more cost-effective than simply increasing per-pupil spending for improving public school outcomes. Links & Resources Mentioned I...

Drew Perkins talks with Valentina Devid  to explore why the term "formative assessment" often fails in practice and how shifting the focus to Formative Action can lead to more sustainable, durable learning. Valentina shares her journey from a history teacher seeking "intellectual nourishment" to a professional development expert specializing in evidence-informed instructional coaching. Links & Res...

Drew Perkins talks with Brendan Lee, a primary school teacher, host of the Knowledge for Teachers Podcast , and advocate for evidence-informed pedagogy. Brendan shares his transition from an initial belief in unguided project-based learning to a more structured approach rooted in the Science of Reading and the instructional hierarchy. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Watch on YouTube Ha...

Drew Perkins speaks with John Sweller , Emeritus Professor of Educational Psychology at the University of New South Wales, and Oliver Caviglioli , information designer and former special school principal, about the foundations and future of Cognitive Load Theory (CLT) . As one of the most influential frameworks in modern education, CLT provides a scientific roadmap for understanding how human cogn...

Drew Perkins talks with Brian Lamb, founder of Swivl, about the "Paradox of Edtech" and how modern digital interfaces are changing the way we learn. They discuss the shift from being "data-driven" to "data-informed," the importance of "decentering" for perspective-taking, and how AI can serve as a reflective thought partner for teachers rather than a replacement for human-led instruction. Links &...

Drew Perkins  welcomes Emily Waugh and Gabriela Delgado de Fina , both Assistant Heads of School for the A+ World Academy. They discuss the academy's unique educational model: a 10-month voyage for 72 students aboard the Sorlandet , a fully rigged ship built in 1927. The conversation explores the challenges and rewards of a "school at sea," where academics, communal living, and maritime training c...

Drew Perkins talks with investigative reporter Chris Papst about his book, Failure Factory: How Baltimore City Public Schools Deprive Taxpayers and Students of a Future . Papst, a reporter for Project Baltimore, shares his deep-dive into why one of the most funded school systems in America remains one of the lowest performing . From systemic grade manipulation to the misuse of school funds, this c...

Drew Perkins welcomes Carole Geneix, Director of Teaching and Learning at Washington International School, to the podcast to discuss the evolving landscape of Artificial Intelligence in education. As schools grapple with the "AI revolution," Geneix argues that instead of fearing these tools, educators must integrate them into content-rich, inquiry-based frameworks to deepen student thinking. Have...

Drew Perkins welcomes education writer and author Natalie Wexler to the podcast to discuss her latest work and the evolving conversation around explicit instruction and the "Science of Reading." While the movement has successfully brought phonics to the forefront, Wexler argues that too narrow of a focus ignores the lessons of the Science of Learning.   Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode...

Drew Perkins   welcomes neuroscientist and acclaimed author Jared Cooney Horvath to dissect his new book,  The Digital Delusion , which provides a rigorous, evidence-based critique of edtech. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Watch on YouTube Horvath doesn't mince words, arguing that the majority of student-facing, internet-connected devices should be removed from schools. He reveals tha...