Work For Humans

Dr. Bob Aubrey has spent decades advancing the field of human development across Asia. With experience spanning 25 countries and six continents, he founded and chairs the Advisory Board of the ASEAN Human Development Organisation (AHDO), which promotes human development across the region and beyond. In this episode, Dart and Bob discuss the global human development movement, where it fits alongsid...

Most organizations are built around hierarchy, clear reporting lines, and top-down control. But a growing number are experimenting with a different way of organizing work through self-management, distributed authority, and evolving purpose. As more organizations experiment with alternatives to traditional management, Matthew Spaur has spent years studying Teal organizations and what actually happe...

Twenty years ago, Abraham Burickson and his collaborators asked a simple question: what if a work of art were designed for just one person? Instead of creating experiences for the masses, they spent months crafting deeply personal journeys for an audience of one. That experiment grew into a new way of thinking about design, participation, and transformation. In this revisited episode, Dart and Abr...

Rishad Tobaccowala has spent much of his career breaking out of boxes. First it was the spreadsheet and the idea that organizations can be managed through numbers alone. Then it was the office and the assumptions built into how we supervise and coordinate work. More recently, he has turned his attention to the broader structures that shape how we work and learn. In this episode, Dart and Rishad di...

After years leading recruiting and talent systems at companies like Bridgewater, Electronic Arts, and Dolby, Jeff Hunter came to believe that many of our assumptions about talent, hiring, and performance are fundamentally wrong. The problem is not that people lack potential. The problem is that the systems around them often fail to recognize or develop it. In this revisited episode, Dart and Jeff...

Many of the problems we care most about cannot be solved by a single organization. That insight helped John Kania develop Collective Impact, a framework for bringing people together around shared goals. But over time, Kania noticed that coordination alone was not enough. Even when groups made progress, the deeper patterns of the system often remained unchanged. In this episode, Dart and John discu...

After becoming painfully aware that he cared more about the numbers than the well-being of his employees, Mark LeBusque began to question his management philosophy. An insight to start thinking of his employees like customers helped Mark breakout of the "employees as inputs to production" model that previously informed his thinking. With this shift in management style, Mark was able to l...

A kidney transplant does not work like buying a gallon of milk. Neither does hiring or getting into a medical residency. In these markets, both sides care deeply about who they end up with, and a good outcome depends on more than money. Alvin Roth has spent his career studying what makes those systems succeed or fail. His work designing kidney exchange programs showed that even when people despera...

When Joan Ryan stepped into the locker room to conduct her first post-game interview as a sports journalist, she was all but kicked out by the players. Feeling both unwelcome and undeterred, she made a firm decision to stick around and make a name for herself as one of the first female sports columnists in the country. Intrigued by the concept of team chemistry, Joan wrote Intangibles , where she...

Most workplaces don’t quite know what to do with faith. It often gets simplified, avoided, or treated as something too divisive to bring into professional life. Elaine Ecklund studies what happens when people try to leave that part of themselves outside the workplace, and what is lost when they do. Her research shows that faith is rarely just about religion. It becomes a window into bigger tension...

People often want conflicting things from work because they carry different ideas about what makes a good life. What feels meaningful to one person can feel draining to another, and those differences often go deeper than personality or preference. That is what makes Derek Sivers’s book, How to Live , so useful here. It lays out 27 competing ways to live, each one convincing in its own voice. In th...

Rational choice theory has become so familiar that it can feel like common sense. We talk about trade-offs, optimization, ROI, and risk as if they capture what it means to think clearly. But many of the decisions that matter most do not work that way. They are shaped by context, values, relationships, and the larger story of a life. In this episode, Barry Schwartz returns to discuss how rational c...

In many organizations, some people are focused on keeping the lights on. Others are pushing for change. But what if the future isn’t something out there waiting for us at all? What if it’s shaped by what we do—and don’t do—right now? For Reanna Browne, that shift starts with how we think. Change how we think about the future, and we change how we act in the present. In this revisited episode, Dart...

An 81-year-old woman shows up for work at Home Depot while managing serious health issues. She isn’t there because she loves retail. She’s there because stopping isn’t really an option. That story is one of many Noah Sheidlower encountered while reporting on Americans working into their 80s and 90s. Together, they point to something that's changing about retirement: for many people, it doesn’...

Most organizations approach change as something to manage. A new strategy, a new structure, a new set of goals. But what if real transformation doesn’t come from plans or policies, but from experiences that change how people see themselves and each other? Claus Raasted and Paul Bulencea design those kinds of experiences. Through the College of Extraordinary Experiences, they bring together people...

Josh Block became president of his family’s medical imaging company at 29, just months after layoffs had shaken trust across the business. People were asking whether he was ready. His answer was simple: not fully. But he knew what he didn’t know. That humility became the starting point for how he chose to lead. Instead of protecting his position or pushing for performance at any cost, Josh shifted...

Many companies treat experience as the final layer of the business: a nicer interface, a friendlier script, a smoother customer interaction. But the real experience of a company comes from something deeper. It grows out of the systems, incentives, and environments that shape how people behave. If those foundations are wrong, no amount of design can fix it.  Experience architect, Alain Thys, has sp...

In a world that feels increasingly uncertain, making confident business decisions is hard. So we grasp for certainty. Numbers feel certain, but they often give us the false comfort of measuring the wrong things. In her book Embracing Uncertainty , Margaret Heffernan explores a different approach. Looking at artists, writers, and musicians, she asks what we can learn from people who produce extraor...

William Hurst is all too familiar with the disasters that have resulted from tops-down governance. Through years of fieldwork in China and Indonesia, William has seen what happens when decision-makers are cut off from life on the ground. In this revisited episode, Dart and William explore how companies experience similar problems when they try and optimize complex systems for narrow outcomes. Will...

Toxicity at work isn’t always obvious. Most times, it shows up as sarcasm, neglect, and unresolved conflict. Catherine Mattice learned this firsthand while working as an HR leader inside an organization where one person slowly broke a good culture. Leadership would not step in, and she watched good people leave. That experience led her to spend years helping organizations understand and address th...

Kentaro Toyama spent a decade designing technologies to fight global poverty and improve education and health. As co-founder of Microsoft Research India lab, he made a troubling discovery – innovative technologies can’t create change on their own. Realizing that social progress depends more on people than on the technology they use, Kentaro became a self-proclaimed “geek heretic” who now teaches o...

Geoffrey West didn’t set out to explain work. He was a physicist trying to understand why living things grow, age, and die. But when his questions expanded into biology, cities, and organizations, they offered a way to think about why growth changes how organizations behave and why success often brings new constraints. In this episode, Dart and Geoffrey discuss why work feels different as organiza...

After decades in education, Dr. Peter Liljedahl realized that many classrooms fail to engage the people inside them. Rather than accept that reality, he began challenging every classroom norm he could find, asking a single question of each one: does this increase thinking? What followed was a decades-long effort to redesign learning environments from the ground up, dramatically increasing student...

Ethical questions at work rarely show up as rules or compliance issues. They show up in the systems organizations design and the outcomes those systems produce. And even well-intentioned leaders can create harm without meaning to. In this episode, Dart and Ed explore legitimacy, responsibility, employees, power, and why acting ethically inside complex systems is so difficult, even when people know...

Experience is brand. The experiences people have with a company shape how they feel, what they trust, and whether they stay. Creating those experiences is not just about interfaces or marketing. It requires rethinking internal processes, digital systems, and the everyday realities of work. Alder Yarrow has spent decades helping organizations understand experience from the inside out, and why lasti...