Spencer Pahlke and Justin Bernstein

Unscripted Direct

Conversations with the law school trial advocacy community. Hosted by Spencer Pahlke (shareholder at Walkup Melodia and trial advocacy director at UC Berkeley School of Law) and Justin Bernstein (director of trial advocacy at UCLA School of Law).

Author

Spencer Pahlke and Justin Bernstein

Category

Education

Podcast website

www.buzzsprout.com

Latest episode

Jun 3, 2026

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Episodes

Episode 108 - Is Saban Trucking Liable? 06.02.2025

Introduction (00:00). An email masquerading as "congratulations." The Break (04:03). The winners of the first two NTC regions, results from Chester Bedell, and case balance data from Wooden v. Saban. Interview: David Ball and Artemis Malekpour (10:16). Two of the most famous jury consultants in America talk about Reptile Theory, the classic book David Ball on Damages , and the #1 advice...

Episode 107 - NTC Predictions (Little v. Pasquarello: The Rubber Match) 30.01.2025

We ring in the new semester with: Introduction (00:00). Hiding from relatives, a cross-country roadtrip, and some trials. The Break (11:10). Results from the National Trial League, fantasy football, and the AI Sandbox. The Chapman Challenge (12:40) . John Bishop announces a new competition -- March 29-30 in California -- and invites everyone to apply . NTC Predictions  (17:55). Robert Little v. Ph...

Episode 106 - Advocacy in a Flash! 19.12.2024

We’re back with the Third Edition of the National Flash Trial Competition and its accompanying episode on the pod.  This year Berkeley Law’s annual tournament expanded to ten teams, meaning we got to introduce two more schools to our tradition of learning through flash trials. Join our erstwhile UC Berkeley undergraduate hosts Lucy Cavalluzzi and Melinda Lu as they embed with teams from Houston an...

Episode 105 - The 2025 NTC Case (plus, the Scripty Awards!) 05.12.2024

In Part Two of our Season Finale: The Champagne Mystery (0:00:00). Who's behind the anonymous alcohol?! The 2025 NTC Case (0:03:02). For the first time in the National Trial Competition's 50-year history, the NTC case was written by law school coaches. A day before the case release, the authors -- Matt Woodham, Nick Cotter, Justin Bernstein -- talk about what's different this year....

Episode 104 - Gavel Rankings & US News Rankings (with Erwin Chemerinsky) 03.12.2024

Part One of our Season Finale: Introduction (0:00:00). Happy Tofurkey Day. The Break (0:04:45). Results from the Daniel competition, and the most one-sided rivalry in sports. Erwin Chemerinsky (0:05:50). Berkeley Law's Dean talks about the state of US News two years after the big controversy, why many prestigious law schools ignore trial advocacy, and when his CV will include appearances on t...

Episode 103 - When is Enough Enough? 21.11.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). He's just a humble Nebraskan ... who flies to New York for foot massages. The Break  (0:06:43). Results from five events. Advocate of the Week. Puerto Rico giving away "Finalist" trophies like Oprah gives away cars. And puppies!! Remembering Arturo Alvarez (0:12:27). The community lost an outstanding and inspiring advocate, Nova Southeastern's Arturo Alv...

Episode 102 - Best Athlete in the Community? 14.11.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Justin has a beauty product problem. The Break (0:04:20). The busiest weekend of the Fall -- results from six competitions! Meet Sam DiGiuseppe (0:08:44) . Drexel's new Assistant Trial Competitions Director talks about her new role, her white and brown noise machines, the shelves she can't reach at 4'11", tap dancing for her team. We also tried to ask he...

Episode 101 - "May it please the court. May I blow my nose?" 07.11.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). When Spencer knocks on doors, does anyone recognize him from the podcast? The Break (0:04:11). Results from Quinnipiac, Premiere Austin, and Premiere Fort Lauderdale. Who were the best teams ... and who were the Best Coach-Judges? Adrian Mebane (0:07:00). Loyola Chicago's newly-promoted advocacy director describes her new job duties, her goals, and her unusual gardenin...

Episode 100 - The Roast! 31.10.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Sounds like this episode has a lot of hosts... The Break (0:02:33).  Results from Tournament of Champions, Michigan, St. John's, Syracuse, Gold Cup, and Davis MLK. The Moms (0:06:53). Spencer's mom Penny and Justin's mom Anita make their first appearance together. We find out that Penny has now listened to the show ... and Anita asked if one of our guests was...

Episode 99 - From the Courtroom to Campaign Trail 17.10.2024

It's election season! This episode features two trial lawyers -- and mock trial veterans -- who used their courtroom skills to get elected as district attorneys.  TOC Preview (0:00:00). Who are the new teams? What's the new rule? What do we think of this year's case? And what is Spencer's bold prediction? Main Interview: McGeorge's Thien Ho and Jason Schaff (0:12:41). Thie...

Episode 98 - Murder in Waco 10.10.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Justin gets mocked. The Break (0:03:15). Results from Summit, National Pretrial, and Buffalo. Ravioli as Fiction and Truth (0:05:38). Baylor's Jerry Powell talks about his first novel , featuring a murder mystery in 1800s Waco and Catfish Calloway, the aging trial lawyer who represents the accused. He then gets philosophical about the decline of truth in America — and...

Episode 97 - Nothing Off Limits (Main Interview with Dave Schott) 03.10.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Spencer has two family members in trial. Did they consult him for advice? The Short List (0:03:25). Stetson's Kate Donoghue talks about Hurricane Helene, shares the good news of her promotion, and evaluates Justin's hypothetical "candidates" to fill her old position. Main Interview: Dave Schott (0:18:52). Denver's director talks about starting his o...

Episode 96 - Theory of Negativity (with 3 guests and 5 cameos!) 26.09.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Knock-knocks and birthdays. Win, Lose, or Drawl (0:03:23). In a reaction to last week's episode, four Lone Star listeners teach Justin how to talk like a Texan. The Break (0:08:52). Results from Drexel's Battle of the Experts. Spencer administers some truth serum. Vexatious Litigants (0:12:53). South Carolina's Brett Bayne defends the standard "negative...

Episode 95 - Filmed Before A Live Studio Audience 19.09.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). The Break (00:01:41). Results from First Chair New York, First Chair San Diego, and Tex-ABOTA's Voir Dire Competition. Vexatious Litigants (0:03:42). Mercer's Katie Powers argues that teams should not be allowed to protest an invention of fact unless they attempted an impeachment. Drexel's Phil Pasquarello argues they should.  High jinks ensue. Main Interview...

Episode 94 - Stetson Legend Bobbi Flowers (and a spicy new debate segment!) 12.09.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). One tournament ends, another begins, and a third is resurrected. The Break (0:14:34). Results from Berkeley's FlashTrials. Vexatious Litigants (0:15:46). In the first installment of our new debate series, Fordham's Adam Shlahet and Cumberland's Judge Jim Roberts debate whether competitions should send judges the case beforehand. Main Interview: Bobbi Flowers...

Episode 93 - "If It Happens to One..." 05.09.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Speaking slowly, competing quickly... "...It Happens to All of Us" (0:04:14) Northwestern's Josh Jones and DePaul's Theo Thomas discuss how to more effectively coach Black students and how to build a more inclusive trial program. Where are they now? (0:45:06) 2022 Top Gun champion Haley Kairab talks about what it was like winning Top Gun, how she turned...

Episode 92 - Homecoming (Dan Tilly returns to Baylor) 29.08.2024

It's Season 7! Season Preview (0:00:00). Justin and Spencer preview the six major storylines for the upcoming year, including some big news: Which three coaches will be writing the NTC regionals case? Which three coaches will be writing the NTC nationals case? Homecoming ( 0:17:01). Dan Tilly returns to his alma mater, Baylor Law School. He answers absurd questions about why he made the move,...

Episode 91 - Summer Heat (Interview with TYLA & ACTL Leadership) 06.06.2024

The podcast was supposed to be on vacation ... but we interrupt this summer break for an important update! On May 1 (Episode 89), we covered the witness incident at NTC Nationals. On May 15, TYLA circulated a statement about the incident. We had some follow-up questions. So, we interviewed TYLA and ACTL leadership  about the incident -- and a broader range of National Trial Competition topics. We...

Episode 90 - "I Want to Mostly Thank Myself" 09.05.2024

Introduction . We follow up on last week's NTC critiques and unveil some new competitions. Gavel Rankings (0:10:23). Jared announces the top 10 schools from the '23-24 season, highlights the schools who made the biggest leaps, and wonders if the TOC selection criteria should be updated. Tournament of Champions (0:18:56).  Last week, Judge Roberts "translated" Jared, so Justin a...

Episode 89 - The Bernstein Bear (Main Interview with Justin Bernstein) 02.05.2024

Introduction . Spencer hosts solo! The Break (0:02:07). Results from UCLA's Amicus Cup and GW's Estrella -- as well as Stetson's 2024 EATS awards.  Anger Translator (0:03:48). President Obama had an anger translator . Now Hofstra's Jared Rosenblatt has one, too. Jared shares his opinions on NTC Nationals -- from the case issues, to pairings that didn't match the rules, to...

Episode 88 - Thomas R. Kline 18.04.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Spencer knocks on doors. Justin holds tryouts. Main Interview: Thomas R. Kline (0:07:37). The Jim Beasley Story. The Pizza Kelly Story.  The Third Chair Story. The "Birthday Present to Myself" Story. The Beating-His-Grandson-at-Squash-and-Talking-Smack Story. Then Tom answers some pressing questions: What's the next Thomas R. Kline School of Law? What's...

Episode 87 - Hijacked 11.04.2024

Introduction (00:00).  Spencer visits New York. Justin revisits a past mistake. The Break (06:23). Results from STAC Nationals, NTC Nationals, and the San Fernando Valley Competition. Recap from Both Nationals (09:36). How balanced were the AAJ and NTC nationals cases? Did the new coaches review committee make a difference?  What did we think of NTC's new fourth preliminary round? Did the new...

Episode 86 - Nationals Preview! 02.04.2024

Introduction ( 0:00:00 ) . Spencer and Justin answer questions from listeners. Nationals Predictions ( 0:08:14 ). Brett Bayne and A.J. Bellido de Luna predict the winners at NTC and AAJ Finals . A.J. tries to color code. It doesn't go well.  Both guests manage to offend several schools and coaches while making their predictions. Our Predictions ( 0:32:42 ). After Spencer survives a field trip...

Episode 85 - The Uber Driver Who Knew A Lot About Mock Trial (Interview with Katie Powers) 28.03.2024

Introduction . (00:00:01) Spencer's newest project: The Bay Area Trial League. Justin's newest project: the burger he ate afterwards. The Break. (00:10:54) Results from four competitions -- including some not yet announced on the listserv. Main Interview: Mercer's Katie Powers. (00:15:33) Katie specifies the one instance when she’s called "Kathryn," explains how she was ap...

Episode 84 - How to Lose Like a Champion 21.03.2024

Introduction (0:00:00). Spencer and Justin discuss how they conduct tryouts, and it leads to a broader conversation about how they structure their respective programs at Berkeley and UCLA. The Break (0:14:45). Oops.  Losing Graciously (0:17:08). Stetson's Liz Boals and Cumberland's Sara Williams discuss how coaches can teach their students to handle competition losses with professionalis...

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