The Messy Middle

Shadeh Smith spent more than fifteen years building culture for some of the biggest names in music. From Kehlani and Burna Boy to Ed Sheeran, and more recently the new world of streamers like IShowSpeed and Kai Cenat. She came up the hard way, from picking up laundry and driving artists to becoming a music commissioner and creative director at Atlantic Records. Then she walked away from the machin...

Before he was producing films. Before television. Before building entertainment companies. Julian Boothe was a young immigrant from Jamaica trying to find his place in the music business. Along the way he worked alongside Uncle Luke, discovered Pitbull before the world knew his name, helped develop artists including Rick Ross, Trina, Trick Daddy and Plies, played a key role in launching Love &...

Michael Vick has been one of the most discussed athletes of our lifetime, but “hearing the story” isn’t the same as knowing the person. In this episode of The Messy Middle , we sit down for a real conversation about identity, leadership, trust, and legacy, and what it actually takes to control your head space when the world is loud. We talk about why people say “ we’ve heard Mike’s story ,” how as...

“To be wealthy in America, you have to own something.” That is the foundation of this conversation with Ricardo Frazer. From Costa Rica to New York to the Pacific Northwest, Ricardo’s journey spans decades in music, business, and mentorship. But his impact goes far beyond the industry. This episode is about: • Why ownership is the foundation of wealth• Understanding contracts and reading every wor...

What is punishment? Is it retribution? Is it rehabilitation? Is it accountability? Or is it something deeper? In this episode of The Messy Middle, we sit inside a courtroom in Henrico County with Judge Nael Abouzaki, one of the youngest judges in Virginia. But this is not a story about power. It is about humility. Nael came to America from a small village in Lebanon at seven years old. He once sat...

Bill McCullough has worn every hat: HBO Sports, GoPro, NFL Media, FaZe Clan, XFL. Eleven Sports Emmys and a career defined by adapting, building teams, and owning the work. In this episode we go inside the engine under the titles: how to protect taste at scale, when metrics sharpen instinct, and why rejection is fuel. In this conversation:- From premium docs to creator worlds- Building the NFL con...

Dr. Jim Olson is a pediatric neuro-oncologist who has spent his life working where science, grief, and hope collide. In this episode of The Messy Middle, we sit down with Dr. Olson in Seattle to trace the path from his childhood in Upper Michigan to the operating rooms where tumors now light up in real time. His work led to Tumor Paint, a breakthrough imaging agent derived from scorpion venom that...

Architect and futurist Ted Givens has spent his career designing at the edge of what’s possible, from Hong Kong towers to kinetic, climate-resilient homes built to move with the weather. In this episode of The Messy Middle , Ted shares how he left the safety of big firms, helped build 10 DESIGN, launched his experimental studio BIRD, and why he keeps chasing ideas that look risky on paper but matt...

Eddie Francis built his career behind the mic, from local radio to Apple Music , but success came with its own shadows. In this episode, Eddie and Wael Abou-Zaki talk about the highs that look perfect from the outside and the lows that force you to start over. They unpack the moments that tested everything: walking away from comfort, facing addiction, finding clarity in recovery, and learning that...

When we first launched this series as PERSPECTIVE , our goal was simple: create space for meaningful conversations about the process behind success; the journey > outcome philosophy. Now, in the most fitting twist possible, the series has evolved into The Messy Middle . Pun intended. We’re living in the creative uncertainty we talk about, pivoting, experimenting, and building in public. It’s im...

We launched this series as PERSPECTIVE , a cinematic interview series built to explore the process, pivots, and purpose behind creativity and growth. But as the journey unfolded, something unexpected happened: the series itself stepped into its own messy middle. So we’re embracing it. From here forward, PERSPECTIVE becomes The Messy Middle because we’re living in the very thing we’re talking about...