The Messy City Podcast

It’s not often you run across people in the development world that have deep knowledge in both the smallest scales of projects and the biggest. The industry, like many, is very bifurcated. People who do small projects tend to keep doing small projects. People who work on really large projects tend to keep doing that for their careers. Joe Perry , who works as his day job as the Vice President of D...

“Just do it. Do it as quickly as you can.” That’s the advice of architect Doug Moss, who came to doing small-scale development projects after working for three decades as an architect. Doug left small-town Texas to pursue a career in New York, and boomeranged back several years ago to pursue his dreams as a developer. Now living in Austin, Doug has a healthy side gig doing small projects in Taylor...

Allen County, Kansas is not a place most people will be familiar with, but the story is one you’ve probably heard before. Located in southeast Kansas, an hour and a half from the nearest major city, it features much that’s typical of rural America. Iola, the county seat, is a city of 5,300 people. It has a classic town square and lies at the junction of a couple of state highways. The beautiful Fl...

Jesse Russell and Ryan Andrews fit the profile of successful small developers. That is, they had no experience at all before trying it, almost no money, but have a ton of passion and creativity. Jesse and Ryan discuss how they came from the worlds of tv show production and finance to create a small development business in beautiful Bend, Oregon. They now focus primarily on cottage-style housing an...

Mayor David Holt , far younger than me, has an impressive resume for any big-city Mayor. He’s been elected overwhelmingly twice, and his city is clearly on the rise. If you’re not familiar with what’s going on in Oklahoma, this is a chance at some insight. Moving out of a dark period in the city’s history in the early 1990s, Oklahoma City took it upon itself to pursue a dramatic makeover. Every ci...

It’s an intriguing irony that we live in the managerial age, with more managers than ever, and yet so much in our society is so poorly managed. But what can be done? Is it just an inevitable fact of modern life? In this episode, I break down my experience using the design charrette process in planning and architecture. And, I discuss the lessons learned from years of creating these very successful...

If you’ve traveled much to countries outside of the US, you frequently see a type of building that sits right up on the street, but has a landscaped courtyard space behind it. Instead of the ubiquitous American form of street-front yard-building-back yard, this type of building lacks a front yard in exchange for park-like spaces in the interior. As architects, we call these a variety of names, fro...

In the urbanism and planning world, we talk a lot about Missing Middle Housing . Rightfully so, since it’s a critical element that helps a community succeed and provide the total range of housing options. And, it’s historically what we used to build a LOT of, before the advent of zoning and modern development codes. Hal Shapiro of Real Property Group in Overland Park, KS, talks with us about his u...

Stop what you’re doing, and listen to this episode. Trust me, it’s worth it. I came across Joe Jimenez by way of Coach Carson , who has interviewed him twice . Joe lives in Kalispell, Montana, and now owns a business called Switchback Suites . Joe and I discuss his interest in the FIRE movement, (FIRE = Financial Independence, Retire Early) and how he eventually translated that into his own world....

Before this episode, I knew nothing about Mineral Wells, TX. Now, i’m interested to visit. Mineral Wells is a small, historic resort town west of Fort Worth. It’s the sister city of Hot Springs, Arkansas. And our guest’s family has been on the forefront to save it from recent decline. For me, this, what Macy Nix Alexander relates to me is how people who truly love their place can be the change tha...

Eric Kronberg, of Kronberg Urbanists + Architects , is a wealth of knowledge for people wanting to truly understand the realities of new construction in cities. First off, it’s Kronberg with a long o, not as I initially pronounced it. Apologies to Eric. Eric and I talk about his work in missing middle housing, working in development in Atlanta, and the opportunities and perils of doing infill new...

So-called “urbanists” tend to travel to foreign lands and come back with the obvious takeaways: foreign cities good, American cities bad. I get that. I understand the impulse. I’ve done it myself, so who am I to judge? But let’s suppose for a minute we put that impulse on pause, and ask, what can we learn that can be applied quickly and inexpensively to American cities? If we look past the charm o...

Monte Anderson of Neighborhood Evolution and Options Real Estate in Duncanville, Texas joins me to talk about extremely practical matters: making money in real estate. That is, as a small developer, how is it actually done? What are the pros and cons of different approaches, such as buying and holding vs selling? We start this by discussing a YouTube video from The Real Estate God. Yes, that’s the...

Truth is, I wish we talked a lot more about making cities as kid-friendly as possible. The topic is often overlooked. That’s why it was fascinating to see Derek Thompson’s article, “The Urban Family Exodus Is a Warning For Progressives” get so much traction. He clearly touched a nerve. Today, I give my take in this solo podcast. As a father, as someone that loves cities, and someone that is in fac...

We travel to the beautiful Pacific Northwest this week to talk with architect Cary Westerbeck. Cary lives and works in Bothell, Washington, a northern suburb of Seattle. He traces his path from being a bicycle mechanic to architect, developer and even Planning Commission member. One of the really cool things about this episode is hearing Cary take me step by step through his process to build the F...

Abby Newsham and I have some fun with a joint podcast this week, as we host Jim Heid. Jim runs the Small Scale Developer Forum , and has a new book called “ Building Small: A Toolkit for Real Estate Entrepreneurs, Civic Leaders, and Great Communities. ” He spent some time in Kansas City while preparing to host his next forum here in October. Registration is open now ! Jim is a wealth of great info...

This week, we take a little different tack and explore a time-worn Missouri rivalry: Kansas City vs St Louis. I invite two born-and-raised St Louisans, Abby Newsham and Jason Carter-Solomon to explore what is working and what is not with these two cities and metros. These two regions dominate this part of the Midwest, but have entirely different cultures and growth trajectories. If you go back far...

There’s so many acronyms in this episode, it might make your head spin. We talk about IRC, IBC, IEBC, ADA, FHA and more. John Anderson and I don’t do this to punish you, or make you feel confused. But, it’s critical to understanding the world of how buildings actually get built. John is usually good for at least a couple of one-liners, and this one is my favorite in this episode: Real estate devel...

There’s a lot of takeaways from any conversation with Joe Minicozzi, or one of his many public presentations. Here’s mine today: omnipotent forces didn’t create our current systems, whether we are talking about zoning, traffic engineering or tax assessment. Or, in fact, just about anything in life. These were all created by fallible humans. We can, and should, change them. It’s our duty, our respo...

I’m not often left speechless when I’m interviewing guests, but for a few moments here I struggled to digest what Rebekah Kik was telling me about Kalamazoo. If you’re a planner, you must listen to this episode. This is a truly inspirational effort in a city that doesn’t get the limelight. For a city of about 75,000 people in a quiet corner of Michigan, the staff and community have done amazing wo...

We must talk about your parking regulations. In fact, we must mock them. In no other area of life do head spins quicker, and people’s opinions take on truly bizarre forms, than we we talk about parking. I get it, we are a culture obsessed with driving and parking. It’s part of nearly adult’s daily routine. In this episode, Tony Jordan of the Parking Reform Network and I have some fun with it, whil...

It’s no secret in the world of transit and streetcars that Kansas City has had one of the most successful new streetcar lines in the country. For a two-mile “starter line,” it’s had an outsized impact on our city’s reputation and civic image. Today, I talk with the man behind RideKC Streetcar, Tom Gerend. Tom is a planner by education, but work took him eventually into the world of transportation...

As I said right off the beginning of this interview, I really love it when worlds collide in my own life. It’s one of the more joyful aspects of doing a podcast, and talking with people in real life. Chad “Coach” Carson is someone in the Financial Independence world that I’ve listened to and followed for some time. He’s a very genuine guy, and his particular niche focuses on using small-scale real...

Frank Starkey and his family are one of those rare breeds of Floridians that actually have deep roots in the Sunshine State. We talk about how they sought to owner their grand-dad’s wishes as they ultimately developed the family cattle ranch in New Port Richey. A big part of their work was the Traditional Neighborhood Development (TND) called Longleaf. And later, the Starkey Ranch project. Here’s...

Aaron Lubeck and I sat down in Cincinnati, during CNU 32, to talk a lot about housing, policy, and how to actually make change. Aaron writes a Substack called On Housing , where he frequently explores these issues. And, he’s one of the founders of Southern Urbanism , which has a terrific array of writers and feature pieces. Some of the posts we discuss: I am Going to Gring Back the Sears Home What...