Kevin Klinkenberg
The Messy City Podcast
Embracing change, uncertainty and local initiative for our cities and towns kevinklinkenberg.substack.com
Author
Kevin Klinkenberg
Category
Podcast website
Latest episode
Jun 23, 2026
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Episodes
How to Scale Change with Housing 23.06.2026 50:02
Eric Kronberg is back again, to dive deeper into the topics of housing choice, scale and essentially - what works and what doesn’t. Eric’s firm, Kronberg Urbanists & Architects , produces some of the routinely best graphic content to explain these complex issues. In this episode, in particular we discuss his updated Housing Choice Catalog , which is a tour de force of a document for anyone remotel...
Midtown KC, Unfiltered 19.05.2026 1:36:37
Stand by for a very Kansas City-focused episode. For this one, Abby Newsham and I were invited to record a live podcast during KC Design Week , at the Kansas City Art Institute. Abby now hosts the Unconventional Urbanism podcast. While there’s some inside baseball in here for Kansas City people, we also cover issues that are germane to cities all over, including: * development / redevelopment issu...
Route 66 - America's Main Street 12.05.2026 50:33
The tale of Route 66 might seem like just a tale of freedom on the road, the great American desire for exploration, and our love affair with the car. And it is all that. But it’s also much more. It’s about the cities, towns and unique places all along the route and their stories. Chris Elisara and John Paget are sharing those stories, in a 100th anniversary documentary about Route 66. I happened t...
Chicken on a Bridge 06.05.2026 44:04
Sometimes a local story is just that - a local story. And sometimes it transcends. Yes, Mike Zeller is very much rooted in Kansas City, and this is a very local story about how to take advantage of our long-overlooked river assets. But this story is really so much more than all that. This is about finding value in what other people might not see; about perseverance; about not giving up when so man...
Seeking Faith-Based Solutions to Housing 30.04.2026 52:23
Every so often, an idea comes along that makes so much sense it makes you wonder - why haven’t we been talking more about this? In that vein comes today’s guest, Eli Smith, who is pioneering something called the Faith-Based Housing Initiative . Eli describes it well, but there’s a fascinating juncture here of issues related to churches and faith institutions of all kinds; the societal issues aroun...
You Can Just Do Things 14.04.2026 41:31
Zach Molzer is 25, and he wants you to know that’s an advantage. His team is young, energetic, and optimistic. His story of quickly becoming a developer with impact in Kansas City shows us that you don’t need to have decades of experience. You just need to want to do it badly, and get others excited about your vision. In just a couple of short years, Zach has created a company , undertaken two ver...
Rowhouses for America 07.04.2026 49:09
Bobby Fijan doesn’t want you to give up on families living in cities. One thing he said in this episode that really stuck out with me, “People tolerate disorder less when kids are around.” I think that’s right on, and that we too easily acquiesce to the notion that cities are just for the young, or the retired. Bobby , like many of my guests, isn’t content to just talk about the issues. He’s becom...
The Case for Optimism and Beauty 31.03.2026 1:08:23
Social media is an unlikely place to find truly positive and optimistic people. But occasionally you find one. Today’s example: the charming and determined Coby Lefkowitz, whose relentless optimism can only rub off on you. Coby is a developer in New York state, and a prolific writer, poster and speaker on the value of beauty in the built environment. He’s written a book called “Building Optimism”...
The Best Life Hack, Ever 17.03.2026 50:35
We take a break from our routine conversations today to have some fun, and talk about the wonders of travel hacking with my sister, Cindy Weir. Cindy epitomizes how to really leverage having a system for travel hacking, as she made the most of her small business to rack up points. It’s paid off incredibly for her, as she’s traveled to 22 countries in just the last five years, in addition to doing...
Do our communities need better hardware or better software? 03.03.2026 1:07:37
Longtime friend-of-the-pod Abby Newsham returns, on her hiatus from the popular Upzoned podcast. Abby is a practicing planner in Kansas City with Olsson Associates . Abby is very active working with communities leading planning charrettes, and we talk at length about what a charrette actually is, the value of it, and why doing charrettes can actually give you hope that people can solve problems to...
What is a Starter Home? 10.02.2026 44:51
One of the perils of being in a profession or field for many years is how you see beyond simple dualities. By that I mean, you hear people argue confidently and vehemently about X vs Y, but you know there’s actually a Z they’re not even thinking about. Sometimes people talk about this as a “third way” solution. I confess that my whole life and career I’ve mostly been interested in those “third” wa...
A Conversation with Ross Chapin 02.02.2026 1:07:28
One of the great trends in housing from recent decades has been the revived interest in micro-communities, especially those organized around shared courtyards. I first started to learn about this in the late 1990s, and am delighted to say it’s really picked up steam since then. Ross Chapin has been at the forefront of all this, and taught many of us how to do it well. In this episode, Ross talks a...
Reality in the Rust Belt 27.01.2026 1:02:41
Jason Segedy returns for his third appearance on the show, as Jason now works in North Canton, Ohio as the Deputy Director of Administration. Jason has also gotten more active on LinkedIn in recent months, with his usual provocative and insightful thoughts on a variety of topics. I highly suggest you look him up! We hit on why a huge supply of older homes may not be an advantage, especially in a w...
You Have Agency 20.01.2026 43:42
After three years of podcasting, I share some thoughts on why I do this, and what I hope to achieve and share. Maybe you like it, maybe you don’t - either is fine, really. But my focus is and will continue to be on people who take concrete action, not on obsessive policy wonkery. It’s not that policy wonkery doesn’t matter - it’s just that too many people waste too much time focusing on it, when l...
Transforming Your Own Backyard 30.12.2025 1:01:42
For a guy that never intended to be a developer, Steve Nygren is having a remarkable impact on development and so much more. Steve led the development of Serenbe , which is a “biophilic” community southwest of Atlanta. This story is nothing short of remarkable. Even if nothing more had happened than getting 500+ property owners that control about 60 square miles of land to agree on a framework for...
Brooklyn Doesn't Need Your Butt 17.12.2025 1:00:02
One of the mantras of small or incremental development workshops for years has been, “no one is coming to save you.” The solution to your neighborhood’s or community’s problem isn’t some outside force. It’s you. A similar mantra has been, “Brooklyn doesn’t need your butt.” Make it more colorful at your own leisure. We are often attracted by the allure of the sexy place, but it’s the not-sexy place...
Unpopular Ideas to Fix the Housing Market 10.12.2025 52:05
One of the most shocking pieces of information I’ve seen in the last year is how high the average age of all homebuyers has become. Depending on the source, I’ve seen between 59 and 62 years old. This is the *average* age. We’ve never seen a housing market quite like this, so I turned to Charlie Bilello , the Chief Market Strategist for the firm Creative Planning to help me understand it better. W...
Can California Forever begin to cure the state's housing woes? 25.11.2025 50:47
About forty years ago, the New Urbanism came on the scene with bold and creative ideas for building entirely new towns. The founders of the movement intended to prove that we could really build beautiful, walkable new places in America, much like some of our historic norms. Those early communities captured incredible attention, far beyond their actual size. And they’ve influenced a couple generati...
How to Unleash the Swarm 11.11.2025 1:08:16
Andrew Burleson asks us to think about, “what is the system that creates space for people to live?” Systems thinking may seem terribly wonky, and in reality, it is. But systems thinking gave us the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and a whole host of ideas that underpin western civilization. Systems thinking was behind the movement that created administrative city planning and zoning in the 19-...
Talking Abundance and Strong Towns 28.10.2025 1:06:29
Right off the top, I must say I always enjoy talking with Seth Zeren. Seth fits the mold of most of my favorite people, in that he’s a deep thinker AND a do-er. His ruminations are baked in the reality of trying to actually build things every day of the week, and he operates from a deep set of principles for placemaking. In other words, he really tries to get things done and done well - not just t...
Reflecting on Leon Krier 21.10.2025 55:14
A few months ago, we lost Leon Krier, one of the all-time greats in the world of architecture and urban design. I’m joined by Dan Parolek of Opticos Design to reflect on Krier’s work and influence, and his personal experiences working with him on multiple projects. Krier’s work and his many drawings have been foundational for so many of us that came through the world of New Urbanism. His simple, e...
Reframing the Housing Discussion 14.10.2025 1:04:01
Chuck Marohn of Strong Towns joins me in the studio to dive deeply into the world of housing finance and housing policy, fresh on the heels of his book, Escaping the Housing Trap: The Strong Towns Response to the Housing Crisis . For an architect and engineer to dive into this world might seem anathema to economists, but we go there anyway. The topics range from the thirty year mortgage and its di...
Episode 100: What is Your "Why?" 07.10.2025 1:46:15
I’ve been an avid podcast listener since the early days of podcasting. It’s probably one area where I was a bit of an early adopter for technology. My guess is this is in part due to the fact that I grew up listening to a lot of radio, especially radio shows in the car when my parents were driving. So I suppose you can say I’ve always been interested in the audio side of conversations and entertai...
Incremental Success, One Not Sexy Project at a Time 30.09.2025 1:04:55
One thing that’s really obvious when you talk with Johnny Youssef is that he’s just a very positive and happy guy. And, frankly, it’s amazing what he’s accomplished at a still-young age. Johnny started his journey in Egypt, and eventually landed in Kansas City as a small developer and rental property owner. We talk about how he focused on the not-sexy parts of our region, and quickly built an inco...
From Small Developer to Mayor 23.09.2025 51:14
Kevin’s note: Apologies on the audio quality. Riverside did something funky to this episode, and I did my best to correct it. We all love to study success, and learn how to emulate it. Allan Branch likes to study failure. He studied it for his businesses, and for his city. Remarkably, it’s helped lead Allan to a lot of success in all his endeavors. Allan traces his roots from art school and family...
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