The Conversation
Politics with Michelle Grattan
The Conversation's Chief Political Correspondent Michelle Grattan talks politics with politicians and experts, from Capital Hill.
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The Conversation
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Podcast website
Latest episode
Jul 8, 2026
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Episodes
The Making of an Autocrat: suppress the people 04.01.2026 16:25
The list of people Donald Trump has punished or threatened to punish since returning to office is long. It includes the likes of James Comey, Letitia James, John Bolton, as well as members of the opposition, such as Adam Schiff, Mark Kelly and Kamala Harris. In fact, he has gone so far as to call Democrats “the enemy from within”, saying they are more dangerous than US adversaries like Russia and...
The Making of an Autocrat: beat the courts 28.12.2025 18:30
In democratic systems, the courts are a vital check on a leader’s power. They have the ability to overturn laws and, in Donald Trump’s case, the executive orders he has relied on to achieve his goals. Since taking office, Trump has targeted the judiciary with a vengeance. He has attacked what he has called “radical left judges” and is accused of ignoring or evading court orders. The Supreme Court...
The Making of an Autocrat: manufacture a crisis 28.12.2025 15:45
Donald Trump has sounded the alarm, over and over again, that the United States is facing an “invasion” by dangerous gang members. He blames immigrants for the country’s economic problems and claims protesters are destroying US cities. Trump is not the first would-be autocrat to manufacture a crisis to seize extraordinary powers. As Natasha Lindstaedt, an expert in authoritarian regimes at the Uni...
The Making of an Autocrat: recruit an architect 28.12.2025 17:30
Every autocrat needs a clan of loyalists, strategists, masterminds – these are the figures behind the scenes pulling the strings. They’re unelected and unaccountable, yet they wield a huge amount of power. This is the role Stephen Miller has played for Donald Trump – he is the architect in chief for the second Trump administration. He has so much power, in fact, he’s reportedly referred to as the...
The Making of an Autocrat: hijack a party 28.12.2025 18:31
We used to have a pretty clear idea of what an autocrat was. History is full of examples: Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Mao Zedong, along with Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping today. The list goes on. So, where does Donald Trump fit in? In this six-part podcast series, The Making of an Autocrat, we are asking six experts on authoritarianism and US politics to explain how exactly an autocrat is made –...
The Making of an Autocrat, coming soon 21.12.2025 1:45
We used to have a pretty clear idea of what an autocrat was. History is full of examples: Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Mao Zedong, along with Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping today. The list goes on. So, where does Donald Trump fit in? In this six-part podcast series, The Making of an Autocrat, we ask six experts on authoritarianism and US politics to explain how exactly an autocrat is made – and whe...
Politics with Michelle Grattan: Jim Chalmers on the Bondi terror attack and the mid-year budget update 17.12.2025 24:43
The treasurer says the government needs to do more on several fronts: from fighting antisemitism after Sunday's deadly attack, to cracking down on illegal tobacco. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025
Sarah Hanson-Young on the social media ban as a risky 'fake silver bullet' 08.12.2025 37:20
The Greens' senator says she's worried kids will end up 'in other online spaces that are even darker and more dangerous' – and Australia should act on other options. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s...
Tim Ayres on the AI rollout's looming 'bumps and glitches' 03.12.2025 24:19
The industry minister denied Australia's adopting a 'light-touch' approach on AI – and says he's working to make sure data centres are 'not a drain on resources'. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s pre...
Sussan Ley on Barnaby's defection and how the environment law deal 'fell apart' 27.11.2025 24:16
Ley says the Opposition was negotiating on the new environment laws with the government into early Thursday – just before Labor announced a deal with the Greens. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s pre-...
Liberal Andrew McLachlan on why he'll still promote net zero 18.11.2025 22:22
The South Australian Liberal senator says he's "dubious" about being able to sell the Coalition's new policy to voters – describing it as "carefree with emissions". Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in re...
Murray Watt on the compromises to pass new environmental laws before christmas 13.11.2025 28:04
With only one sitting week of Parliament left this year, the environment minister reveals the compromises he's willing to make and the hard lines he won't cross to get the deal done. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, si...
Michelle Grattan remembers the day Whitlam lost his job 09.11.2025 15:16
Michelle Grattan and the politics and society editor for the Conversation Amanda Dunn, talk about the dismissal. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conve...
Niki Savva and David Solomon on The Dismissal 05.11.2025 28:21
Next week is the 50th anniversary of the dismissal of the Whitlam government. We're joined by Niki Savva and David Solomon to talk about their memories of that day. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s p...
Sam Rae on big changes to aged care 29.10.2025 29:24
Amid rising demand for aged care, major changes are rolling out from Saturday. Minister for seniors Sam Rae explains what the overhaul means for older Australians. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in rea...
Tony Abbott on Australia's past and the opposition's future 21.10.2025 34:31
The former Liberal prime minister says he wrote a new history book 'to help contemporary Australians think better of themselves'. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocr...
Pollster Tony Barry on why the Coalition can’t risk ‘lurching to the right’ 15.10.2025 30:06
The former Liberal strategist turned pollster says the Coalition has become "catastrophically uncompetitive" with women and younger voters. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of...
Andrew Jakubowicz on repairing our 'fragile' multicultural nation 08.10.2025 29:31
The multiculturalism expert says increased tensions since the October 7 attacks have raised 'the tideline of hate speech' in Australia. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an...
James Paterson on Andrew Hastie, Sussan Ley and himself 02.10.2025 27:14
Opposition finance spokesman James Paterson canvasses the economy and the budget, says the Liberals need to sort out its stance on net zero sooner rather than later. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in r...
Former diplomat Ian Parmeter on an Israel-led 'one-state solution' 25.09.2025 34:20
The former Australian ambassador turned scholar says despite more countries recognising Palestine as a state, a peaceful two-state solution is slipping away. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s pre-emin...
Tony Wood on 'politics trumping climate policy' and the hard road ahead 17.09.2025 26:18
The energy expert says Australia's only on track to cut its emissions by around 50% by 2035 – 'so we're going to have to step up the pace' in the next decade. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real tim...
Abul Rizvi on how silence and stalling stoke anti-migrant fears 03.09.2025 20:37
A former deputy secretary of the immigration department under the Howard government says 'it's time politicians on both sides pulled up their socks'. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s pre-eminant scho...
Health Minister Mark Butler on kids on the NDIS through to aged care funding 28.08.2025 28:16
The health minister also says fewer kids are now vaping because of the government's ban, which 'exploded' as a health problem during the COVID years. Mentioned in this episode: Your support matters Support non-profit journalism you can trust. Donations 2025 The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The...
Shadow Treasurer Ted O'Brien and industry chief Andrew McKellar's reform wish list 19.08.2025 35:08
Both men say the government has a 'spending problem' and are urging the federal government to think beyond raising taxes – especially for business. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s pre-eminant schola...
Union boss Sally McManus on the push for shorter work hours in the age of AI 14.08.2025 19:25
McManus doesn't expect instant wins on shorter work hours from next week's economic summit, but says it still needs to be on the table – along with AI protections. Mentioned in this episode: The Making of an Autocrat Search: "The Conversation Weekly" for our new series. Is America watching its democracy unravel in real time? In The Making of an Autocrat from The Conversation, six of the world’s pr...
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