zeroheight
Design Systems WTF
A podcast from zeroheight. Let’s be honest, design systems are full of choice wtf moments. Michelle and Luke, two of our resident design advocates, are attempting to combat this with a new regular series, where they answer a single question around design system troubles every two weeks.
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Episodes
Is driving adoption just a polite way of begging 07.07.2026 40:18
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Adoption has been the perennial curse of design systems. Always a problem, never quite fixed, and loads of...
If AI can generate your design system docs, what does that say about how valuable those docs were in the first place? 22.06.2026 43:10
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. The State of AI in Design Systems report came out recently, and it shows that everyone is using AI to crea...
Is Figma holding design systems back? 26.05.2026 46:28
Is Figma holding design systems back? Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. It's the month before Config! So we're diving into a spicy...
How do you make developers to care about your design system? 12.05.2026 37:09
Episode 54 - How do you make developers to care about your design system? Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Getting developers interested in...
Is a design system mandate worth fighting for? 28.04.2026 40:30
Episode #53 - Is a design system mandate worth fighting for? Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. The Design System Report this year suggested...
Does your design system need a PM? 31.03.2026 40:46
Episode 52 - Does your design system need a PM? Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Time for the hot takes - do design systems need product ma...
What do you actually test? 17.03.2026 34:43
Episode 51 - What do you actually test? Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Once you've done a first pass on anything in your design syst...
Do MCPs care more about patterns or components? 03.03.2026 47:05
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Now we're in the business of creating context for AI (ew), what is actually important when we're...
Are we delighting enough in our design systems? 17.02.2026 41:00
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Design systems kill creativity, right? We've heard that said so many times. But are we actually takin...
Do our design systems give new joiners anxiety? 03.02.2026 32:55
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Set the scene - you've joined a new company as a product designer or engineer, and you're confro...
What will happen in design systems in 2026? 20.01.2026 39:41
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. It's time to peer into the crystal ball and predict what's coming up for design systems this yea...
What's with the emotional baggage with design systems? 06.01.2026 37:35
Design system folks seem to be prone to burnout, arguments, and generally feeling underappreciated within their organizations. What makes design systems folks so prone to being loaded with additional weight? We discuss why this happens, as well as some strategies to overcome it. Show Notes Amy Hupe – "Burn baby burnout" (based on her Converge Manchester 2023 talk): https://amyhupe.co.uk/...
Are we reducing complexity with design systems?? 23.12.2025 32:01
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. Time to get spicy... One of the big promises of the hype of design systems was that it would reduce organi...
Episode 44 - Should we care about consistency? 09.12.2025 46:53
Live recording of the fortnightly podcast Design Systems WTF (back for season two!), where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with a Q&A from the live audience. A bit of a deep topic this week – how important is consistency as a concept to be aiming for with design s...
Are we finally at the point of contextual documentation? 25.11.2025 39:44
Season 2 Episode 1 Design Systems WTF is the fortnightly podcast where Luke Murphy and Michelle Chin attempt to combat all the amazing wtf in design systems. In each episode, they answer a single question around design system troubles with Q&A from the live audience. We took a few months off and y'all went and changed everything... We dive into the wonderful world of contextual design sys...
Can you actually measure the ROI of a component? 02.06.2025 24:19
Selling the value of your design system to folks who don't necessarily understand it is a difficult and thankless task. But are we trying to sell in the right things? Is it possible to put the value of our design system against the bottom line, and how far down the stack can we go? Can we actually put a dollar sign against a single component?
Should designers know how to code? 19.05.2025 29:45
The age old question – should designers know how to code? Or more specifically, how much should designer know when it comes to code? Considering it's the medium that we're designing for, it's still surprising how much this topic splits opinion. Luke and special guest Rob Whitfield will dive into the pros and cons, and give some practical advice if you did want to delve into the witc...
Are accessibility guidelines enough to be inclusive? 05.05.2025 25:28
Making your design system as inclusive as possible is something that I think we all agree on. However, for most systems teams, this means creating some accessibility guidelines and then ticking it off the list. Is this enough? Is there more we can be doing?
Are design systems a dead end? 21.04.2025 31:22
Inspired by Luke's article on the death of design systems, Michelle and Luke dive into whether design systems have a future... are we at a natural point of evolution or are design systems going to go the way of the dinosaurs?
How big is too big for a design system? 07.04.2025 27:26
How big is too big? Is there a point where your design system just becomes unwieldy? Luke and Michelle dive into this question from a previous episode, and try and figure out how you keep your design system to a manageable size. Or is that just a nice problem to have, and we should embracing our systems to grow to the size they need to be?
When is OK to snowflake? 25.03.2025 25:44
Detach instance is a concept that has stuck fear into the hearts of design systems folks since the beginning. However, there are definitely instances where it’s totally ok to snowflake components! How should you deal with snowflakes in your system? How does this play into your overall view on flexibility, and can you actually use snowflakes as a way to determine what you should be working on?
How much is too much documentation? 17.02.2025 27:01
Sometimes we may feel the urge to include everything in our documentation, to the point where it rivals Lord of the Rings for length and density. However, we may be doing ourselves a disservice! How much is too much documentation? How much is not enough documentation? Do we even need documentation at all? join us for the last Design Systems WTF of the year!
Where should design systems sit in your org? 03.02.2025 29:41
Design systems should sit in the design team. Design systems should sit in the designops team. Design systems should sit in their own team. There are so many different options that are presented as the ‘truth’ when it comes to design systems and org design. Michelle and Luke are going to wade through the options, weigh up their merits and probably tear the entire thing down to the ground by the en...
Should we get rid of infinite scroll? 20.01.2025 27:41
Infinite scroll was designed to enhance the UX for browsing search results, but now it's often used to keep users endlessly engaged on social media. As concerns grow about its impact on mental health, especially among young people, it's time to reconsider its place in design systems. What responsibilities do we have as creators when our components contribute to these issues? In this epis...
Do design systems make teams go faster? 06.01.2025 29:11
Design systems are often hailed as the ultimate productivity boosters for devs and designers alike, but do they really deliver on that promise? We’ll explore whether design systems genuinely make teams more efficient or if they just add another layer of complexity. Tune in for a reality check on the true impact of design systems on team performance!
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