Known Ministries
Conversational Counseling
Conversational Counseling is where discipleship and counseling meet. Each season we help you apply biblical truths to your everyday life and to the lives of those around you. After decades of having these conversations in the counseling room and side by side over coffee with friends, we really believe that every single thing we’ve learned is useful within family, with your friends, at your work, with your neighbors and at your church. For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org. Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Author
Known Ministries
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Podcast website
Latest episode
Jul 9, 2026
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Episodes
S6 Bonus / Shauna Van Dyke with Association of Biblical Counselors (ABC) 05.03.2024 46:14
We are SO thrilled to share this bonus episode with you!! Our colleague and quickly becoming dear friend, Shauna Van Dyke, is the Executive Director at the Association of Biblical Counselors (ABC). Shauna has an amazing heart to equip believers for the work of ministry as she sincerely believes we are all called to care. That every single one of us can live out the "one anothers" in our daily live...
S6 Ep. 1 / Christine Chappell: Help When Depression Overwhelms You as a Mom 29.02.2024 59:23
Note: This episode is particularly one mother sharing her story, but this episode will not merely benefit moms. We think the principles we talk about apply to anyone whose world has been turned upside down and is facing depression. We hope you enjoy… >> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If y...
S5 Ep. 8 / Tim Challies: A Story of Immeasurable Suffering and Incomparable Hope 05.12.2023 52:34
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) We’re honored to share time here together with Tim Challies. Tim’s firstborn and only son, Nick, died at college in 2020 after suddenly collapsing...
S5 Ep. 7 / When All Hope Seems Lost 28.11.2023 42:47
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) There are times when we just can’t see a way out. When all hope really does seem lost. Even very committed Christians can face very, very dark tim...
S5 Ep. 6/ How Can I Suffer Well and Help Others? 27.11.2023 39:53
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) Suffering well might sound like a contradiction, but it is the process of going to God over and over again and allowing Him to change us through the...
S5 Ep. 5 / What is God Doing in My Suffering? 14.11.2023 27:18
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) God, what good can come of all of this suffering? What are you doing in it? How long until it’s over? These are questions we have probably all asked our...
S5 Ep. 4 / How to Write a Lament 07.11.2023 37:53
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) In our conversation this episode we walk through the importance of practicing lament and how to write our own laments to the Lord. Through the practice of...
S5 Ep. 3 / Carol Collier on Lament: How to Cry Out to God in Suffering 31.10.2023 46:14
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) In our conversation this episode, we get to hear from Carol Collier who walked the horrific journey of watching her husband die of ALS. And not too long after...
S5 Ep. 2 / Where is God in my suffering? 24.10.2023 35:20
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.) The general question of why there is suffering in the world is hard enough to wrestle with. But so often, our theoretical questions really spring from a place in...
S5 Ep. 1 / Why do I suffer? 17.10.2023 23:53
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << We suffer because we live in a fallen world. None of us escapes the impact of pain and sorrow and even outright evil. And honestly, this is probably one of the hardest things to reconcile for anyone who believes that there is meaning in this life. Sometimes...
S4 Ep.9 / Perfectionism 09.09.2023 40:27
Have you ever felt like you are constantly striving for something that is never quite good enough? Or maybe you just feel like you're always falling a little short? If so, then this episode might be especially for you. This week’s common struggle is perfectionism. Whether we can see it in small areas or all throughout our lives, perfectionism can quickly become exhausting, exacting and exasperatin...
Bonus Episode / Elyse Fitzpatrick 29.08.2023 1:03:34
On this bonus episode of Conversational Counseling we are so excited to talk with Elyse Fitzpatrick! Elyse has spent the last 40 years in the biblical counseling sphere asking two very important questions - what do women need to hear and how can I get it to them? She has paved the way for women in the biblical counseling movement and continues to help teach people how to walk alongside others. W...
S4 Ep. 8 / Fear of Man 23.08.2023 39:59
Click HERE to get the FREE Anti-Psalm handout (it'll be sent to your email) Fear of Man, also known as people pleasing, is the common struggle Brenda and Alex take us through this week. We are reminded that we were created to be known and know others deeply - but people pleasing distorts that into an inordinate desire for approval or inordinate fear of disapproval. These desires and fears can lead...
S4 Ep. 7 / Bitterness 16.08.2023 38:29
Click here for the Lament Resource mentioned in Episode 7. Bitterness is the complicated, yet common, struggle that Brenda and Alex take us through this week. Bitterness can cause us to feel powerless and will begin to shape how we view the world around us, how we see the past, and how we anticipate the future. If it continues we can begin to lose hope and forget that God is writing the story and...
S4 Ep. 6 / Depression 09.08.2023 50:06
For the Personal Lament Handout Click Here Depression is a common but complex struggle that all of us will encounter in our own lives or in the lives of people we love. In this episode Brenda and Alex begin by addressing what depression is and walk through possible causes for it in our lives. Looking at it holistically they address our physical and spiritual lives, the influence of other people,...
S4 Ep. 5 / Guilt 02.08.2023 36:11
For the Seven A’s of Confession Handout click here. In this episode Alex and Brenda explore guilt. By walking through the difference between subjectively feeling guilty and objectively being guilty we can begin to work through where and how guilt is affecting our walk with the Lord. It’s important not only to recognize the difference between guilt and shame that Brenda and Alex discuss, but also...
S4 Ep. 4 / Anger 26.07.2023 44:00
Click Here to have the Anger Journal Handout sent to your email In this episode Brenda and Alex begin to unpack Anger. Anger is an all encompassing response - we feel it in our bodily responses, our mental value judgements, and our emotional reactions. Through exploring the differences between righteous and unrighteous anger in the journaling exercise provided in this episode we can begin to work...
S4 Ep. 3 / Anxiety Part 2 19.07.2023 41:51
>> Get FREE Anxiety Journal and Biblical Thought Filter handouts << In our second episode on anxiety we bring it to a personal and practical level as Brenda walks through one of her own anxiety journals with Alex. As they walk step by step through the Anxiety Journal exercise (that is available for free on our website) Brenda and Alex show us how to take a very real moment of anxiety...
S4 Ep. 2 / Anxiety Part 1 12.07.2023 49:19
>> Get a free handout on visual theology that goes with this episode! << Anxiety is one of the most common struggles that we all face today. And it can be no small thing. We experience anxiety as a whole person so it impacts our thinking, feelings, body and behaviors. In this episode Alex and Brenda discuss how anxiety affects us holistically and how to address these different factors...
S4 Ep. 1 / Wisdom for Life's Common Struggles 05.07.2023 39:21
>> Get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling! << This season of Conversational Counseling is all about offering wisdom for life's common struggles. In this episode Brenda and Alex begin with introducing the six topics that will be discussed throughout the season that are common to us all. What we'd like to do over this season is to bring clarity...
S3 Bonus Episode/ Marty Solomon Conversation 14.04.2023 51:31
On this episode of Conversational Counseling we are thrilled to have Marty Solomon, creator and executive producer of The BEMA Podcast join us! We talk about the how Jewish scholarship teaches us about the ministry of Jesus and therefore our ministry to others, the theme in the story of the Bible of God's desire to restore relationship after disruption, the value of a deeper understanding of th...
S3 Ep.7/ Miserable Counselors: Key elements of everyday ministry 31.03.2023 34:47
Let’s be honest, sometimes as we walk with one another, we just miss it. None of us are perfect and sometimes we get on people’s nerves and even outright hurt them. In this episode, we highlight some of the ways we can really just be miserable counselors in everyday ministry. Even though we address some serious misses, hopefully you’ll find yourself laughing through this episode and taking yoursel...
S3 Ep. 6/ Ministry of Words: Key elements of everyday ministry 24.03.2023 40:35
So often when we think about feeling inadequate in ministering to others, it’s because we don’t think we’ll know what to say. We hope by now in this season, that we’ve shown you (ironically, with our words… ha!) how even though we tend to think words should be used first in ministry, so often they really need to be used last. Before we speak, we really have to remain humble enough to recognize tha...
S3 Bonus Episode/ A Conversation with Dr. Curt Thompson 17.03.2023 50:12
On this episode of Conversational Counseling we are thrilled to have Dr. Curt Thompson share about interpersonal neurobiology and embodying the gospel to one another. We talk about the incredible science of the brain, the Scriptures, how important physical presence is, cultivating community, telling our stories more truly, paying attention to our bodies, suffering, transformation, and more! Dr. Th...
S3 Ep. 5/ Asking Questions: Key elements of everyday ministry 10.03.2023 32:46
Many of us can think of someone who is just really good at asking questions. It can seem like an unobtainable skill, yet it’s really something we can all grow in! Rather than assigning motives and misunderstanding people, we can truly just ask the next question to get to know them. Not simply fact finding to satisfy our curiosity, but really learning who they are. Learning to ask better questions...
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