New Kinship

Kinship isn’t build overnight. A tree doesn’t go from a sprout to a great oak in a day or two. Relationships need to be started, watered, cultivated, and maintained. We discuss some theological turning points that have shaped our practice of friendship and community, particularly in contrast to the marriage-dominant narratives we grew up with. But we really try to get a little practical in this ep...

Our friend Joelle joined David and Tyler this week to talk about her unexpected journey from identifying as bisexual and spending time in queer (and Christian) spaces to experiencing what she describes as the disappearance of her same-sex attraction while exploring Eastern Orthodox Christianity. They talk about social media and dating apps, attraction and lust, marriage, and how Joelle’s relations...

Laurie Krieg joins David, TJ, and Tyler for a practical conversation about how parents can respond when their child comes out as gay or trans. Drawing from her own story and work with parents navigating these moments, Laurie explores the fear and shame that can shape these moments and offers instead a posture of curiosity, listening, emotional steadiness, and continued conversation. We’re grateful...

This is Part 2 from our conversation in August, so if you haven’t listened to that yet, you may want to start there. We finish our conversation about whether Side B should function more as a discernment toolkit or a confessional movement. We also explore how boundaries relate to creation and freedom (Genesis, Galatians 5), the risks of reductionism or wrongly drawn lines, and areas needing ongoing...

Francis is a Vietnamese-American Catholic experiencing same-sex attraction and an extremely thoughtful friend! He joined us to share about his experiences with: family conversations and coming out, discerning the priesthood, pursuing celibacy, finding support through Eden Invitation, and the creative possibilities of celibacy and rootedness. We appreciated this conversation and hope it speaks to y...

In follow-up to some thoughtful considerations from our friend Odessa in response to our first Kinship Lab discussion on the Future of the Side B project, we continue the conversation around a potential covenant that could bind this nascent movement together. Our particular focus is on the dynamics and risks of harm (with and without) defined boundaries. This is Part 1, so stay tuned for part 2 in...

Our friend Hannah is a Brazilian-Canadian Side B Christian. She stopped by to share some reflections on how faith, family, and culture have shaped her understanding of sexuality. Also included: coming out in Latin American and North American church contexts, the value of therapy and Side B community, and the intentional friendships and practices that have sustained Hannah as she seeks a rooted, fa...

Shela Chan joins us to discuss her journey to faith and the research that now shapes her work at the intersection of queer theology, ethics, and social science. Drawing on her own story and doctoral research, Shela examines how theology and empirical insights can inform Christian understandings of human flourishing, belonging, and trauma while challenging the ways churches can unintentionally marg...

As Side B Christians, we’ve done a lot of discernment around the ethics, practice, and vocation of celibacy ( celibacy = practicing sexual chastity as an unmarried person ), including discernment around lifelong vows of celibacy. In our own journeys, we’ve uncovered myths we’ve believed and encountered myths in our Christian communities. We argue that celibacy and mixed-orientation-marriages are i...

Jon-Michael Shelley, a youth pastor in Atlanta, joins David and TJ to share about his journey as a Side B Christian from a Southern Baptist upbringing into the Anglican tradition. He discussed how liturgy, community, and pastoral care shaped his healing and vocation, and how he has come to understand sexuality as an integrated part of faithful discipleship and ministry. Jon-Michael also reflected...

What's the big deal about celibate partnerships?! Pieter Valk wrote an article in 2023 with a significant critique on celibate partnerships, but in 2026 he made significant revisions with an expanded imagination for the possibility and goodness that these kinds of relationships can play for Christians who are looking to live chaste lives within relationships of belonging and mutual care. If you ar...

How do the comparisons we use for queer sexuality shape the way we think, believe, and respond to one another? TJ and podcast manager Elena explore—with new and previous guests—some metaphors Christians use to understand “being gay.” We talked strengths and limitations of each metaphor and how it can impact the lives of LGBTQ+ people. Take a listen, and then join the conversation on Substack! Note...

David and TJ talked with Akwasi in Ghana about growing up Pentecostal while wrestling with same-sex attraction (SSA). Akwasi shares candidly about the cultural and church pressures surrounding sexuality and marriage in Ghana, and his commitment to pursuing holiness and discipleship even as his attractions remain. He also reflects on the challenges SSA Christians face in his context and his hope to...

Following up on our earlier conversations, we engage the Side B project. Yes, project. Side B is often thought of as a community of queer/SSA Christians committed to the traditional, Christian sexual ethic. But the Side B project is much bigger than just being honest about not being straight and being steadfast in our theological ethics. We review and riff of Grant Hartley’s article on this very t...

We are glad to have Mwendia Steve Kiengu back on the podcast to hear about his ministry in Kenya and across Africa. Found is a ministry to build a Christ-centered community walking alongside believers experiencing same-sex orientation and gender dysphoria, guiding them toward truth, love, and belonging. This is the only Side B ministry in the entire continent of Africa (Side B integrates experienc...

Have you heard of Revoice? If not, then maybe that’s because you’ve been living in the woods… or in the closet. Come tune in and hear an update on what’s going on at the Revoice Conference and beyond from Revoice's founder and President, Nate Collins. TJ, Tyler, and David get to hear from Nate about the changes in the ministry over the years, including the change in the scope of the ministry as it...

The whole gang talked with Erin Moniz—Baylor University chaplain, Anglican deacon, and author of the excellent book Knowing and Being Known —about developing a Christian theology of intimacy. Erin’s approach to intimacy offers as a valuable critique for our culture’s obsession with romance and sex. Even more importantly, she offers a positive theological vision, exploring how friendships, family,...

In light of the Colorado Supreme Court case Charles v. Salazar and prior conversation with Julia Sadusky and other conversations with Side X guests, we dig into Conversion Therapy (also called Reparative or Reintegrative Therapy), particularly how it intersects notions around the fluidity of sexuality. Reports on sexual fluidity opens new questions to the ethics of conversation therapies, and mayb...

Our friend Neth is a father, grandfather, and licensed counselor—and at the first Revoice conference in 2018, he came out to himself as gay, at the age of 54. In this episode, Neth reflected on growing up in an abusive Christian home and how this experience shaped decades of his life. Speaking both personally and professionally, he talked with us about mixed-orientation marriages, why naming yours...

Logan Morrison is a trans man who leads Kaleidoscope’s trans outreach ministry in New York City. Logan talked with TJ and Tyler about coming out as trans and losing a job over it, and how Christian gospel and Christian communities had positive and negative impacts on him and many others. Tune in also for conversations about: how we distinguish experiences of gender vs. sexuality (”are you trans, o...

Tyler Parker, David Frank, and TJ introduce a new monthly-ish podcast format called the Kinship Lab , created to reflect on recent interviews/events or other emerging ideas. Comment below on any questions or topics you’d like to see in the future. In this first Kinship Lab, they reflect on a recent two-day summit of a handful of Side B leaders, emphasizing growing capacity for fruitful conversatio...

Eve Tushnet (writer and cofounder of Building Catholic Futures) joined Tyler, TJ, and David to talk about forms of kinship beyond marriage—specifically vows of friendship or lifelong celibate partnership. Eve reflects on her own journey to Catholicism, to serving the church as a gay Christian, and to discerning a lifelong partnership herself. ★ About Our Guest Eve Tushnet is the author of two awar...

In Part 2 of our conversation, Odessa offers a deeply reflective exploration of gender through philosophical, theological, and lived lenses. From mushrooms to Aristotle to Christian eschatology, Odessa invites each of us into a nuanced dialogue about embodiment, faithfulness, and what holiness and hospitality might look like amid contemporary debates about gender. Part 1 can be found here: https:/...

In this episode, Odessa—a transgender woman and former Anglican priest—shares her journey of transition alongside a deep wrestling with faith, vocation, and identity. She reflects on growing up with alienation and shame, the freedom she’s found in embracing her femininity, and the costs of that journey for her family, church, and relationships. Odessa also explores the intersections of gender, neu...

David Frank and TJ talked with historian Dr. Dan Hummel about why many Evangelical Christians support the modern state of Israel—and its implications for kinship between Christians and Jews. Dan traces the theological roots of Christian Zionism, the rise of dispensational theology, and some political and social effects we see today. We also covered how Christians have related to Jewish communities...