The Rollup

Dan Held joins us to unpack what it means to become a generational investor in today's world. For reference, he bought Bitcoin in 2012 and recently sold a lot to pour it into SpaceX, and says the thesis has barely started. The longtime Bitcoin investor lays out why Starship's collapsing launch costs could unlock a total addressable market bigger than global GDP, why he thinks this cycle ju...

Arthur Hayes joins us for a session to understand the underlying economic forces leading to a massive digital assets bull market in the coming months and years. The money printer is about to flip back on and Arthur Hayes says the Euro/Yen exchange rate is the tell everyone's missing. He gets into why Japan's forced unwinding of its massive carry trade, combined with France's brewing bo...

Jake Chervinsky joins us in the Tokenization Tower to explain the path for Hyperliquid to enter the US markets. Trump said "Hyperliquid" on national television and Jake Chervinsky was there to watch it happen live. He explains why perpetual futures are already coming to the US through the CFTC, why Hyperliquid is infrastructure rather than a competitor to exchanges like Coinbase and CME,...

Taylor Lindman calls in during a pivotal moment of Robinhood Chain stock token mania to debrief us on how the SEC is approaching tokenization. He explains how Reg Crypto could be the biggest shakeup to token fundraising since the JOBS Act and Taylor Lindman just laid out exactly how it works. She breaks down why tokenized "stock tokens" from Robinhood and others are legally structured more like de...

Ryan Watkins joins the show for an updated view on the digital assets bull market Are traders are about to become bigger celebrities than athletes? Well, maybe or maybe not. He breaks down why Hyperliquid's real endgame was always taking share from Binance and Coinbase, not just onchain rivals, and makes the case that barbell portfolio of store-of-value assets and revenue-generating businesses...

Emad Mostaque breaks down the viral story of OpenAI's self-replicating agents that left "hieroglyph-like" trails for successive generations before breaking out and taking over internal services, and explains why he believes intelligence's cost is racing toward zero. He also unpacks Intelligent Internet's Bitcoin-forked monetary thesis for a post-AGI economy, and details his p...

Will Clemente joins us for an update on the imminent digital asset bull cycle. He breaks down the significance of Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent's long-bond buybacks before Jackson Hole, explaining why the move to backstop yields could force excess liquidity into the system and make Bitcoin & other digital assets an increasingly attractive hedge. He also unpacks his financial repression...

Austin Barack breaks down why Pump.fun isn't really a meme coin platform. Rather, it's building social trading infrastructure that's about to expand across chains and asset types and explains why the market is mispricing one of the fastest-growing businesses in the world by treating its revenue as cyclical rather than durable. He also discusses the ongoing debate over buybacks as a value accrual m...

Robert Leshner joins us to unpack his vision of the tokenization supercycle with the explosion of stablecoins as the core undercurrent. He breaks down why over a dozen major banks including Bank of America, Wells Fargo, and Santander, just announced plans to launch their own stablecoins, and explains why he left Compound to build Superstate, a compliant, tokenized approach to money market funds an...

Zach Pandl joins us for an investing masterclass on how to allocate to privacy in the age of AI. He breaks down how Grayscale converted its nine-year-old Zcash trust into an ETF, following the same playbook that took its Bitcoin trust public, and explains why rising AI-powered surveillance is the real catalyst driving renewed interest in financial privacy. He also details the Ironwood upgrade'...

Alex Cutler breaks down how Coinbase's partnership with Aerodrome turned cbBTC into the top-traded Bitcoin venue onchain within a week, and explains why he believes the same playbook is about to repeat with tokenized equities at a $100 trillion addressable market. He also unpacks Coinbase's thesis that 10% of global GDP could move onchain within five years, and why he thinks true beneficia...

Circle's new agentic finance wizard Shafu Elfouly joins us to unpack why he's betting his career on the acceleration of agentic finance. He breaks down x402, the 30-year-old unused HTTP payment status code that stablecoins finally activated, letting AI agents pay for API access with one unified wallet instead of juggling dozens of subscriptions and API keys. He also takes us through Circle...

ARKInvest Digital Asset team Raye Hadi and Lorenzo Valente join us for a state of digital assets special. We debate whether token buybacks actually create value or if the correlation with top performers is just circular logic. They also tackle the trillion dollar question: whether Solana and Ethereum even need to capture fee revenue if they're hosting trillions in assets, and why Hyperliquid&#...

Mert Mumtaz and Dev, the Osmosis founder now leading Zcash scaling at Valor Group, join us to explain the massive developments in Zcash as of late. The two of them break down how over 90% of Zcash's supply migrated out of the Orchard pool following the Ironwood upgrade, addressing the vulnerability fears that spread across the community. They also unpack the upcoming Tachyon upgrade's post...

Rain Co-Founder Charles Yoo-Naut joins us for a look underneath the exploding neobank sector, which has exploded from $5m/month to $250m+/month in crypto-card volume in less than a year. He breaks down how Rain went from a stablecoin-backed card issuer for crypto-native DAOs to a platform powering over 200 card programs, including a landmark partnership with Western Union and more. Charles Yoo-Nau...

Robbie and Andy debate Morpho founder Paul Frambot's controversial take that token buybacks are "shooting yourself in the foot" versus the market's clear reward for programmatic buybacks from Hyperliquid, Lighter, and Pump. They break down Luca Prosperi's corporate finance framework for when buybacks make sense based on market conditions and return on equity, and make the cas...

Joseph Chalom and Kean Gilbert break down why SharpLink staked $200 million in ETH through Lido, making the case that unlike Bitcoin, Ethereum is a natively productive asset that treasury companies have a duty to put to work. They unpack why a proposal to cut Ethereum's staking issuance would undermine the risk-free rate anchoring DeFi lending and push institutions toward competitors like Sola...

Daryl Xu joins us to explain the biggest shift happening in AI. He introduces B3 IQ, a platform that lets anyone rent-to-own AI compute instead of relying on centralized API providers, and makes the case that using decentralized inference has a hidden cost most people overlook: your proprietary data. He also explains why inference demand keeps climbing even as GPU prices depreciate slower than exp...

Bitwise's CIO Matt Hougan and Head of Research Ryan Rasmussen break down why institutional ETF investors kept buying through the summer's 50% drawdowns and explain why they expect the next bull market to look a lot different than previous ones. They also make the case that ETF flows are expanding, what institutional allocators really want to buy, and the long-term forecasts for top digital...

Edward Woodford, CEO of zerohash breaks down their new Visa Direct partnership, which lets Visa move value instantly across its 12 billion endpoints in over 190 countries using stablecoins. He explains how zerohash quietly powers stablecoin infrastructure for Stripe, Morgan Stanley, and BlackRock's BUIDL fund. He also makes the case that stablecoins are just the first tokenized asset class, an...

Matthew Sigel breaks down why the AI buildout looks more like the 19th-century railroad boom than a bubble about to pop, comparing capital scale, financing structure, and multiyear purchase order backlogs. He also explains why VanEck has gone underweight major L1s like Solana in favor of corporate chains from Circle, Stripe, and Robinhood, and why he believes a CLARITY Act relief rally could be &q...

Jesse Pollak joins us on CLARITY week to break down how Base is leading in trading, onchain finance, and payments. He also explains how x402 agentic payments and tokenized inference are turning Base into the settlement layer for AI agents, something we've been excited about for a while. He also gives a real update on the long-awaited Base token, Ethereum and the scaling Base is bringing, and a...

CLARITY final countdown special today on the show. We're getting the legal, investor, builder, and the onchain business-impact angles in today's show. 00:00 Intro 05:10 Equities Rally And Earnings Momentum 09:01 SEC's Rulemaking Backup Plan 10:44 Tokenized Deposits Explained 17:48 Open USD And Permissioned Chains 19:39 Base's Internet Exchange Vision 21:23 Tokenizing Equities On Avalanche 26:14 Wr...

Haseeb Qureshi breaks down why crypto markets have become numb to CLARITY Act headlines, and explains why Western Union partnering with Dragonfly portfolio company Rain signals stablecoins are already eating into legacy payment margins. He also makes the case that tokenized deposits are "basically uninteresting" compared to stablecoins, and questions whether Tempo's Open USD consorti...

Cody Carbone breaks down the real vote count behind the CLARITY Act and explains why ethics has become "the whole ballgame" holding up trillions in potential capital inflows. He also draws parallels to the GENIUS Act's rocky path to passage, making the case that history says this bill still gets done. Cody Carbone is the CEO of The Digital Chamber, a leading blockchain advocacy organ...