The PERSUIT Podcast

Debra Counsell followed an unusual career path to her current role as Chief Legal Officer and Company Secretary at BlueScope Steel .  Her time with DLA Piper and Clifford Chance took her from the crumbling sidewalks of Hanoi, Vietnam, to Africa, the Middle East, and Paris, France. The broad range of thorny legal issues she encountered during this period were great preparation for her transition in...

Samantha Wellington entered into inter national corporate law because it was a fascinating way to witness how law forms culture and culture informs the law. During 12 years at Oracle , she had the opportunity to become a member of the board of directors in Tokyo and Mumbai, where she gained insight into the impact of leadership and sponsorship. In her current role as Senior Vice President, Chief L...

Olga V. Mack grew up in Siberia. It's rare for someone to become a world-class lawyer where she's from. Yet, here she is. Olga began her legal career with Wilson, Sonsini, Goodrich & Rosati where she studied IP, security, and privacy “before those things were cool.” From there, she moved in-house where she provided legal advice for companies like Visa , Zoosk , and Clearslide . After 15 years...

Contracts are deliberately ambiguous and resistant to automation. For the most part, companies have difficulties extracting any perceivable value from them. It’s a problem all too familiar to legal departments across the business landscape. With Knowable , CFO Alec Guettel tackles this problem by transforming what has often been a liability for GCs into an incredible advantage.  This isn’t Alec’s...

Mary O’Carroll began her career in investment banking and management consulting, but before long, she was pulled into the nascent world of legal operations. In her 13 years as the Director of Legal Ops at Google , Mary was instrumental in defining the scope of this newly created position. As the President of CLOC , she built a community focused on the mission of increasing awareness around the leg...

To be a successful lawyer, you need to be a critical thinker and an expert communicator. But according to James Kelleher , Chief Legal Officer at Liberty Mutual Insurance , the key to success lies in being two other things as well — liked and trusted. James knows a thing or two about building a successful law career. During 39 years at Liberty Mutual Insurance, he rose through the ranks of the leg...

Attorney, news junkie, and tireless pro bono advocate Tom O’Neill has been on both sides of the corporate law fence. After law school at Notre Dame, Tom joined Jenner & Block of Chicago — a diverse, 100-year-old firm committed to social justice and serving the community. Content, Tom thought he’d never leave — until he received a fascinating offer from Exelon , a major supplier of the country’...

In what role could a family legacy of law and an interest in business intersect? In legal operations, of course. In this episode, I interview Mike Haven, Senior Director, Associate General Counsel, Head of Legal Operations at Intel , about his fascinating career path and its origins. What we talked about: - The evolution of Mike’s career, beginning in eighth grade - His learnings at his different...

Leading cultural change within a legal department requires consistency and innovation in response to situations such as the COVID-19 pandemic and telecommunication. Anat Hakim , Senior Vice President, General Counsel and Secretary at Eli Lilly and Company , joins the show to discuss her humble beginnings, building resiliency and recognizing it in others, and strategies for cultural initiatives. Wh...

If Louise Pentland could give her 25-year-old self a piece of advice, it would be this: be willing to fail. The EVP, Chief Business Affairs and Legal Officer at PayPal said that failure has been her most valuable career experience. That’s why she hires teams with an eye for innovation and resilience. Recently on Innovative Legal Leadership, Louise talked with us about:- The trajectory of her stunn...

Having mentors and a strong sense of resilience can make all the difference when finding your footing within corporations and law firms as a minority or woman. Hiring groups need to spend time not only on hiring with diversity in mind, but also on retaining the diverse employees. Vanessa Watson , Vice President, Senior Managing Counsel at Mastercard International, describes her incredible journey...

Vanessa Sutherland pursued a law degree and an MBA so she could combine her passion for analysis with a love for finances and taxes. She worked in the telecom and tobacco industries gradually advancing through in-house roles with increasing responsibility. In 2011, she received an incredible opportunity to become the GC of a federal agency — the DOT . Currently, she is the Executive VP of Governme...

Ann Kappler ’s first passion was theatre. But while pursuing acting, a day job as a paralegal sparked a new interest: law. At Jenner & Block , she worked with insurance agent trade association clients, which led to two Supreme Court arguments. After accepting a position as Deputy General Counsel at Fannie Mae , she discovered a love for the strategy and people management aspects of in-house wo...

Sabine Chalmers started in private practice at Hogan & Lovells . While there, she had a great view into how different types of businesses were run. But she quickly realized she wanted to be part of a business. She started her in-house career with Guinness and later became GC North America of Diageo followed by CLO of Anheuser-Busch InBev . Currently, she is the Group GC at BT . We discuss: - T...

During his early years as an associate, Rishi Varma took up an interest in what it meant to grow a company and what he could bring to the table. In his career, he followed that passion with roles as acting GC for Technology Holdings (India), followed by 5 years as the President and COO of Trico Marine Services, a company with $500 million in revenue. Currently, he is the GC and Corporate Secretary...

Minority- and women-led law firms fighting for equal opportunities is a continuing struggle. Raising awareness and presenting clear strategies to eliminate the discrimination are essential to creating change. Leslie Davis , CEO of the National Association of Minority & Women-Owned Law Firms ( NAMWOLF ), joins us to discuss her journey into law and how she’s moving the needle for these firms. W...

After a middle school field trip to Yosemite National Park, Akshay Verma was inspired to pursue environmental law. After a stint as a paralegal for Latham & Watkins , he went on to practice environmental law at Farella Braun & Martel . He then transitioned to legal consulting and business development at Axiom . Today, he’s Director, Head of Legal Ops at Facebook where he helps their legal...

As a competitive chess player in his college days, Alan Tse gained an appreciation for having to make timely tactical decisions. Like competitors in the game of kings, lawyers must often make important judgment calls without all the facts at their disposal, even if that means tough lessons may follow. Now the Global Chief Legal Officer and Corporate Secretary at Jones Lang Lasalle , Alan leaned on...

Darren Zeidel began his career at Skadden before the siren call of working in a business environment brought him to Honeywell as the VP and GC of Business and General Aviation. After close to 10 years at Honeywell, he jumped over to Aon where he is now the EVP, GC, and Company Secretary. Topics covered: - Learning how to leverage intangible assets - Compensating for vulnerabilities caused by the p...

Mark Chandler learned early on that he didn’t love practicing law in a law firm. Instead, he discovered a love for being inside a company, serving consumers and building products. His first GC role was for the disk drive company Maxtor in 1988, followed by a position as the top lawyer at StrataCom. From there, he spent the next 25 years working at Cisco , 20 of those as GC. Topics covered: - Bring...

Unlike at a traditional law firm where there’s a structure to your career progression, Harvey Anderson discovered a democratization of opportunities within web companies. He has worked as an Associate GC at Netscape, a COO at Medscape and Flywheel Communications, an SVP of Corporate Affairs and GC at Seven Networks , an SVP of Business and Legal Affairs at Mozilla , and a CLO at AVG Technologies ....

Bruce Byrd started his career in private practice working his way up to partner at Dickinson Wright before making the transition to corporate law. He worked at AT&T for 20 years spending the last few as Chief Legal Officer. Currently, he is Executive Vice President and General Counsel at Palo Alto Networks . What we talked about: - Seeking out honest feedback in pursuit of growth - Highlights...

Thomas Barothy has journeyed from a finance background into legal, spending some time as a CFO and Head of Risk Control before jumping into his present role as Group Legal COO at UBS . He shared with me some of his greatest surprises and insights from his first couple of years optimising the legal department and creating a legal business plan. What we talked about: - Transitioning from finance to...

Chris Fowler started his career as an in-house counsel for Volkswagen and Experian . He then made his way to BT , where he has been the Head of Major products, COO of the legal function, and, currently, General Counsel BT Technology and Transformation. What we talked about: - Getting up to speed on the operational side of running a legal department - Automating basic tasks to free people up for bi...

After starting his career at a law firm doing work he didn’t like, Rob Fletcher found the perfect fit as a business lawyer at GE . He spent 15 years at Johnson & Johnson working his way up to Worldwide VP of Litigation, and now, he is Chief Legal Officer at Stryker . His advice: develop your business IQ. We discussed: - Expanding business IQ to build knowledge and grow your personal brand - Pr...