The Former Lawyer Podcast

On the latest episode of the Former Lawyer, Sarah takes a break from interviewing former lawyers to talk about a realization that many clients have when trying to find the right post-legal career.   Something can be simple and still not be easy. While these two words are often used synonymously, they aren’t the same. Not in the case of the process of leaving the law. Figuring out what you really w...

This week, we’re sharing the second part of Sarah’s conversation with her husband and former lawyer, Ed Cottrell.  Last week, Ed and Sarah talked about the beginning of his journey into law and some of the events earlier in his legal career. This week, you’ll read about the later half of Ed’s legal career, when he left, and where he is now.  They also talked about what Ed has seen and experienced...

Lawyers are under constant stress and pressure yet always have a “this is fine” mentality. “Everything will be fine,” we keep telling ourselves. But, is it really fine? And, is “fine” good enough?  This week, you’ll read about Ed Cottrell, a former lawyer and most importantly, Sarah’s husband. Ed had a legal career for 13 years before leaving the law for a job in legal tech. You’ll notice the ever...

On the latest episode of the Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah sat down with former lawyer Landis Wade to talk about his journey in leaving the law after practicing for a long time. 35 years, to be exact.  In their conversation, Sarah and Landis touched on many common themes on the podcast and in lawyers that are desperate to leave the law.  Whether you’re new or want to leave the legal profession prac...

Today, we’re talking about a piece of trash advice that can really harm some lawyers who want to leave the law.  We really need to talk about a piece of advice that people give to lawyers about their jobs. Personally, I think that it’s just plain trash advice.  The trash advice we’re talking about today is, “Learn to love where you are.” Again, we’ll talk about why this advice is terrible for lawy...

In this episode, you’ll learn about Aliza Shatzman, a former lawyer turned co-founder of a non-profit called Accountability Project.  Aliza shares the circumstances that led her to decide to leave the legal system and start The Legal Accountability Project. The Legal Accountability Project seeks to ensure that as many law clerks as possible have a positive clerkship experience while extending supp...

On the latest episode of the podcast, Sarah had a conversation with Adam Pascarella about his journey in and out of Biglaw.  Adam is currently the founder and CEO of Second Order Capital Management. But before that, Adam worked in Biglaw as an associate and ended up writing a book while leaving the law.  The process Adam went through to figure out what he wanted to do after leaving the law is so i...

If you’re a regular listener, you know that I practiced law for ten years, and now, I help unhappy lawyers ditch their soul-sucking jobs. On this podcast, I share advice for aspiring former lawyers and interviews to help you through the process of leaving and finding a new career.  Today, I want to talk to you about why I didn’t do career coaching for lawyers when I first started Former Lawyer and...

On the latest episode of the Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah spoke with Navneet Mann, a former lawyer and listener of the podcast turned professional coach! She has her own practice, helping lawyers and other business professionals with business and mindset coaching.   In this conversation, they talked about many different topics, including law firm abuse, the lawyer identity obstacle, and so much mo...

As you know, on the Former Lawyer Podcast, I share advice and strategies for aspiring former lawyers. And, I do interviews with former lawyers who have left the law behind to find careers and lives that they love.  Today, I want to talk about whether or not I think everyone should leave the law. Now, that might sound like a ridiculous question. But it does come up a lot from people that read the b...

Today, I'm sharing my conversation with Karen Spencer. Karen is a former lawyer who responded to my requests for guests who had experience in patent law. Karen has an interesting background, coming to the legal profession from engineering. First, she wanted to work in general commercial law but ended up in patent law. She soared through the legal realm, even making partner at a large law firm...

Today I'm sharing a bit from my conversation with Annie Little, a former lawyer turned coach for lawyers. I had spoken to her before for the podcast. But, I wanted to talk to her again because she has recently been diagnosed with ADHD. This is something that I wanted to talk about but didn’t have my own experience with it. So, I’m happy to share it with you because this is the experience of l...

Today, I am sharing my conversation with David Sparks. David practiced law for close to 30 years and he has only recently left his job in the law to focus on his side hustle, MacSparky.  In our conversation, we spoke about many different things including what he has found surprising about leaving the law, some of the responses he's received, and lots of other things.  I'm excited to shar...

Today is going to be a little bit of a spicy episode, and we'll be talking today about The No Asshole Rule. I'm guessing that most of you in the legal profession have heard of this “rule”.  It often comes up in interviews where you're interviewing with a legal workplace. This happens most often in large firms, but not always. It happens in other contexts as well. We’re also going to...

On the latest episode of the Former Lawyer Podcast, I spoke with Ashley Chi. Ashley worked in Biglaw for seven years in patent litigation. Then, she went in-house and managed outside patent attorneys. Now, she works as a legal recruiter.  The episode was listener-requested, looking for a former lawyer who had experience in Biglaw patent work and has had experience in that field as a woman with the...

As you know, one of the things I do is share advice and strategies for aspiring former lawyers. Today, I'm going to talk about a question that comes up frequently when people are thinking about joining the Collab.  The question I'm talking about is if group programs like the Collab work well for introverts. I am an introvert myself. So. I totally understand feeling drained by interaction...

On the latest episode of the Former Lawyer Podcast, I had a wonderful conversation with Kevin Ha. Kevin has a unique story compared to my other guests because he left the law to do side-hustles and blogging full-time.   I'm excited for you to hear this conversation about how he went from Biglaw to the government to non-profit. And, how he ultimately ended up working on his website and doing s...

This week, I want to talk about an issue that I see come up so often for lawyers. What we're going to talk about today is the mindset of "if you're not suffering in the law, you're not working hard enough." It's particularly prevalent in really toxic work environments or workplaces, where being consistently overworked is normalized.  Want to learn more? Let’s get star...

This week, I'm sharing my conversation with Julie Lythcott-Haims. I first heard Julie share her story on a podcast called The Anxious Achiever Podcast . After listening, I immediately asked her to come onto The Former Lawyer Podcast and share her story. Julie started her legal career in Biglaw, then she went in-house. But after falling out of love with the law for various reasons, she became...

Do I really want to leave the law? Or is it just my particular job? How do I know whether it's just my particular job or whether it's the law entirely? This is one of the most asked questions by people who want to leave the law. I literally have conversations with people about this every week, so we're going to talk about it today.  I can’t answer this question for you. But today, I...

Today, I'm sharing my conversation with Vanessa Kuljis. Vanessa and I overlapped at the same law school, though we didn't meet each other while we were there. I connected with Vanessa while looking for someone to come into the Collab and help my clients specifically with the CliftonStrengths assessment.  CliftonStrengths is an assessment that helps you evaluate your natural talents as yo...

On the latest episode of the Former Lawyer Podcast, I asked Kara Hardin to come back on the podcast to talk about trauma and lawyers. You may remember her previous episode where she talked about leaving the law for a career in mental health.  We've had several therapists on the podcast recently, like Ilona Salmons, who came on the podcast to discuss burnout in lawyers . In all of these conver...

Today, I'm sharing my conversation with Andy Cabasso. Andy is a former lawyer and startup founder that began by starting a legal marketing business in law school with a former college roommate.  He ultimately ended up moving into that full-time and selling that business and starting another one. We’re going to be talking about Andy’s transition out of the law and into legal marketing, and sta...

One of the most frustrating things in the legal industry is when you aren't happy with your job, you're feeling a ton of pressure and stress. But when you try to communicate with the non-lawyers in your life, they don't understand. So today, I want to talk about one specific factor that makes lawyering so stressful. The crushing expectation of perfection in the legal industry. See s...

Today I'm excited to share my conversation with Stinson Mundy with you. Stinson started as a litigator and eventually, opened her own solo practice. Now, she is a director at a company called Envoy Portfolio.  We talked about her legal career journey and later, her decision to leave the law. And we also touched on many common themes that come up on the Podcast.  I just know that everyone read...