A Pastor and a Philosopher Walk into a Bar

Text us your questions! In this episode, we speak with science writer and award-winning journalist Jessica Nordell about her book The End of Bias: A Beginning . It's an extraordinarily well-researched and compellingly written explanation of the science of implicit bias, covering its manifestations in many areas, including sexism, racism, policing, and more. Our conversation tackles how to und...

Text us your questions! In this episode, we reflect on the documentary from Discovery Plus, Hillsong: A Megachurch Exposed .  If you haven't watched the three part miniseries, it's gross, tragic, and maddening, and yet it feels like many of us in the church find a part of our story in this broken story of manipulation, abuse, and consumerism. We talk about the fine line between being wel...

Text us your questions! We speak with philosopher Scott Coley about the phenomenon of pastors and internet theobrogians publicly critiquing the work of credentialed scholars. Why is this so popular, how are those that do it so confident, and how are normal people fooled by it? As Scott asks in an article, "What conditions make it possible for otherwise reasonable people to believe that the ca...

Text us your questions! We've been excited to talk to a Jewish scholar for some time now...and not just for the obvious episode title opportunity, either. For those of us who consider ourselves Christians, to understand Judaism is to understand the roots of our faith tradition. In this episode, we interview Rabbi Or Rose from Hebrew College in Boston, MA. Rabbi Rose specializes in inter-relig...

Text us your questions! There's a little secret pretty much every pastor has that they can't share with their congregation. Well, actually, a number of secrets. We're not talking about dark and hidden sins (hopefully, at least). We're talking about things your pastor believes or thinks that they don't feel safe enough to share with your church. Pretty much all pastors have...

Text us your questions! In the conclusion of our four-part series on LGBTQ people and the church, we speak with Drs. Dawne Moon , a sociologist, and Theresa Tobin , a philosopher, who research and write collaboratively about the experiences of LGBTQ Christians in non-affirming church spaces. This conversation is frank, profound, heartbreaking, and, somehow, funny. We discuss their concept of &quot...

Text us your questions! We return for part two of our interview with Bridget Eileen Rivera, the author of Heavy Burdens: Seven Ways LGBTQ Christians Experience Harm in the Church . In the conclusion, we discuss the common claim that the Bible is "clear" when it comes to LGBTQ issues, when (and why) the word "homosexual" was added to the Bible, what the Greek actually does and d...

Text us your questions! Bridget Eileen Rivera wrote one of the most important books we've read. Period. The book is Heavy Burdens: Seven Ways LGBTQ Christians Experience Harm in the Church , and it's a doozy. We had so much important stuff to talk about that we made this episode a two parter. We chat about the awful stories of trauma and abuse that Queer Christians experience on a regula...

Text us your questions! Finally, we talk about sexuality, the queer community, and why we're affirming. This is a very personal episode (as much as it can be for a couple of straight white dudes). In this episode, we chat about where we came from, where we are now, and how we got there. Within that conversation, we touch on the Bible, philosophy, science, reason, the beauty in the LGBTQ commu...

Text us your questions! This one's fun. Thi Nguyen is a philosopher from the University of Utah and studies epistemology and philosophy of art, community, and games. He also used to be a food critic and enjoys great whiskey. A man after our own hearts. In this episode, we talk about things like the seduction of clarity, moral outrage porn, epistemic bubbles, echo chambers, expertise, and our...

Text us your questions! Buckle up for this one, friends, because Dominique DuBois Gilliard brings straight fire. Dominique's book is, "Subversive Witness: Scripture's Call to Leverage Privilege", and it's a good one. In this episode, we talk about using privilege on behalf of the marginalized, giving power away, what it's like to be Black in America (and in the Church...

Text us your questions! For New Year's, we're revisiting an episode from early in Season 1. We spoke with professional counselor and former pastor Jenny Heckman (MS, LPC, NCC) about dealing with anxiety and staying mentally healthy during the pandemic. We think her insights here are important and every bit as relevant as they were last year. We'll be back on our regular schedule wit...

Text us your questions! Shane Claiborne...what a gem. Shane has written a number of incredible books including The Irresistible Revolution and Jesus for President , and we got the opportunity to chat with him about a whole bunch of things. The cult (and possible heresy) of Christian nationalism, trying to embody the Sermon on the Mount as an American, the death penalty, and a number of other thing...

Text us your questions! Where does real theology and spirituality happen? Should we continue looking to the academy and pulpits or might we find a more embodied and lived theology and spirituality in the kitchens and homes of marginalized women? Kat Armas calls us and our theology to the marginalized and colonized women in her book Abuelita Faith . It's a powerful book that is delightfully de...

Text us your questions! Aaron Niequist has been to the top of the evangelical mountain and has experienced first hand the goodness and the toxicity and the pain that is often a byproduct of that world. He's come out of the belly of the evangelical beast without the bitterness and cynicism that many of us fall victim to. He doesn't want to label himself an Ex-vangelical. He's dreamin...

Text us your questions! We cover a lot of ground in this one folks. You may know Frank Schaeffer as the son of famed evangelical author Francis Schaeffer, but since helping his father found the religious right in America (we're not kidding), Frank has had a dramatic personal transformation and a fascinating career. We talk with him about his new book Fall in Love, Have Children, Stay Put, Sav...

Text us your questions! Danté Stewart's book Shoutin' in the Fire: An American Epistle is one of the most stirring and powerfully written that we've encountered on the podcast. This conversation with him is comparable. He's engaging, funny, and erudite all at once, and he has critical things to teach the white church if we'll listen. He's also super well-read, and he...

Text us your questions! Heavy. Weighty. Decentering. In this episode we discuss the afterlife. What happens when we die? Kyle takes us on a journey through historic philosophical thinking about afterlife and why we just don't know what happens when we die. Randy mixes in some pastoral and spiritual insights here and some possible heresy there...delicious. Content Warning: If the idea of the p...

Text us your questions! This is a fun one, friends. In this episode, we chat with Sameer and Sharad Yadav - identical twin brothers who are a pastor and a philosopher. No, really. Sameer is a theologian and a philosopher who teaches religious studies at Westmont College in Santa Barbara, CA, and Sharad is Lead Pastor of Bread and Wine, a church in Portland, OR. We chatted about so much - theology,...

Text us your questions! CONTENT NOTE: This episode contains discussion of sexual harassment and abuse. We interview author and podcaster Tiffany Bluhm about the depressing trend in the American church and the broader culture of ignoring, disbelieving, and actively silencing women who are sexually harassed or abused, often by church leaders themselves and often to protect institutions with oppressi...

Text us your questions! Randy and Kyle talk with Duke Kwon and Gregory Thompson about their recent book Reparations: A Christian Call for Repentance and Repair , in which they grapple with the church's responsibility to repair the great damage done to African Americans by the history--and ongoing reality--of racism in the United States. Duke and Greg are forceful and eloquent and refreshingly...

Text us your questions! Kyle and Randy discuss faith, reason, existentialism, and what it means to be a Christian with a little help from 19th century philosopher Soren Kierkegaard. We touch on all sorts of fun things, like why being American has nothing to do with being Christian, why being religious isn't the same thing as being Christian, why approaching faith with your brain first is prob...

Text us your questions! We got to talk about the Bible with Pete Enns. This podcast thing can be a pretty good gig. Pete is a biblical scholar, Old Testament teacher and expert, a host of The Bible for Normal People podcast, and (unfortunately) a Yankees fan. We talk about what it means that the Bible is inspired, what it means that the Scriptures are authoritative, contradictions within the Bible...

Text us your questions! In this special episode, we give Beth Allison Barr the floor. Beth wanted to have a conversation with Scot McKnight about Biblical translations, how they come together, and how bias and agendas influence certain translations more than others (we're looking at you, ESV). We interviewed Beth in April about her brilliant book The Making of Biblical Womanhood . Beth has sa...

Text us your questions! In this episode, we chat with C. Baxter Kruger, a delightful Trinitarian theologian from Mississippi. Baxter is the perfect mixture of southern grandpa, scotch aficionado, lover of Jesus, and brilliant theologian. Baxter has written a number of books, many essays, and hosts classes and spaces about the nature and wonder of the Incarnation and our mysterious inclusion into t...